Wed, 21 Jul 1999 18:17:18 -0500 Subject: Re: Bill Waara, Bamboo Icon Jorge,Thank you for letting us know about Bill's death. Though we nevermet, I have fond feelings towards anyone as fascinated with bamboo asBillseems to have been. from what I have read, he must have been quite auniqueindividual. When the angling / bamboo fraternity loses one of itsbrighteststars, we all suffer a little. Please convey my thoughts and prayers to theWarra family as one who never met Bill, but cares and greives anyway.Harry Boyd Jorge Carcao wrote: To all those concerned, I have been asked to pass on some regrettable news. Yesterdayevening Bill Waara passed away. Bill, a Michigan native, had beenbuilding cane rods for over 50 years. Many of you folks have eithercome across some of his rodbuilding thoughts, ideas or techniques atthe various rodgatherings or through the Planing Form. John Longwrote a piece on his life in the Planing Form #44.met Bill in person. I would just like to add that Bill was a specialgentleman, knowledgable, generous, his sparkling good nature &sense of humor unequalled. Some of my fondest memories will be thosenights, when a group of us, huddled around Bill to talk bamboo. I trulywill miss him and cherish our friendship. The arrangements are as follows:Thayer-Rock Funeral Home33603 Grand River, Farmington Mich248-474-4131 Visitation: Thurs. 7-9 PMFri. 1-9 PM Funeral Sat. 11:00 AM Jorge from jswitzer@mnsi.net Wed Jul 21 18:31:10 1999 Subject: calculations/setting of gauge A Big thank you to all you who have responded to my help e-m. Myapologizes decided to go with what they say, "narrowing down the field" and/or, gowiththe least expensive means of fixing the problem.Perhaps some more info. is warranted here. When I was measuring andsetting the forms I first mearured the indicator with the arm straightdown.Secondly, I put the home- made (maple) base and the tip and took anotherreading, thirdly, I subtracted the first reading from the second. Thisfiguring gave me the displacement of the base and therefore when readingandsetting the form at each station I subtracted the reading given by theindicator by the displacement figure. Is anyone following this! Thirdly,this figure then was subtacted from the reading that I got off the station.ie.here are the figures of the first reading:tipp of the rodD. gauge reading reading to set 0...................063.........1/2.................=.031..2..........854........................427 5.....................078........1/2................=39.................839..........................419Hope this clarifies my problem. Should I find the nearest bus and head outof town? from jswitzer@mnsi.net Wed Jul 21 18:31:31 1999 Subject: Fw: calculations/setting of gauge -----Original Message----- Subject: calculations/setting of gauge A Big thank you to all you who have responded to my help e-m. Myapologizes havedecided to go with what they say, "narrowing down the field" and/or, gowiththe least expensive means of fixing the problem.Perhaps some more info. is warranted here. When I was measuring andsetting the forms I first mearured the indicator with the arm straightdown.Secondly, I put the home- made (maple) base and the tip and took anotherreading, thirdly, I subtracted the first reading from the second. Thisfiguring gave me the displacement of the base and therefore when readingandsetting the form at each station I subtracted the reading given by theindicator by the displacement figure. Is anyone following this! Thirdly,this figure then was subtacted from the reading that I got off the station.ie.here are the figures of the first reading:tipp of the rodD. gauge reading reading to set 0...................063.........1/2.................=.031..2..........854........................427 5.....................078........1/2................=39.................839..........................419Hope this clarifies my problem. Should I find the nearest bus and headoutof town? from anglport@con2.com Wed Jul 21 18:45:05 1999 Subject: Re: calculations/setting of gauge James,I admittedly didn't spend enough time to fully understand what youmeantbut I think you might benefit from something I did with my indicator. Makea paper ring to cover the nos on the face and list new nos going the otherway around, so you can still see the lines (for continued accuracy). Atleast that way, once you zero it, you shouldn't have to read subtractivelyto figure your depth at any point.Art At 07:23 PM 7/21/99 -0700, James Switzer wrote:A Big thank you to all you who have responded to my help e-m. Myapologizes havedecided to go with what they say, "narrowing down the field" and/or, gowiththe least expensive means of fixing the problem.Perhaps some more info. is warranted here. When I was measuring andsetting the forms I first mearured the indicator with the arm straightdown.Secondly, I put the home- made (maple) base and the tip and took anotherreading, thirdly, I subtracted the first reading from the second. Thisfiguring gave me the displacement of the base and therefore when readingandsetting the form at each station I subtracted the reading given by theindicator by the displacement figure. Is anyone following this! Thirdly,this figure then was subtacted from the reading that I got off the station.ie.here are the figures of the first reading:tipp of the rodD. gauge reading reading to set 0...................063.........1/2.................=.031..2..........854........................427 5.....................078........1/2................=39.................839..........................419Hope this clarifies my problem. Should I find the nearest bus and headoutof town? from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Wed Jul 21 18:53:07 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) Wed, 21 Jul 1999 18:53:00 -0500 Subject: Re: calculations/setting of gauge Jim,Not too sure I follow all the displacements below. The simplest way togeta close reading is install the dial gauge in the base and add the 60* point.Set the indicator with the point on your forms. Adjust the bezel to zero. Witha new point, that will be awfully close. Then read the measurements forthegroove from the counter clockwise gradations on the indicator. To get itexact,read the article on Chris Bogart's page which was referred to earlier.Harry James Switzer wrote: A Big thank you to all you who have responded to my help e-m. Myapologizes havedecided to go with what they say, "narrowing down the field" and/or, gowiththe least expensive means of fixing the problem.Perhaps some more info. is warranted here. When I was measuring andsetting the forms I first mearured the indicator with the arm straightdown.Secondly, I put the home- made (maple) base and the tip and took anotherreading, thirdly, I subtracted the first reading from the second. Thisfiguring gave me the displacement of the base and therefore whenreading andsetting the form at each station I subtracted the reading given by theindicator by the displacement figure. Is anyone following this! Thirdly,this figure then was subtacted from the reading that I got off thestation.ie.here are the figures of the first reading:tipp of the rodD. gauge reading reading to set 0...................063.........1/2.................=.031..2..........854........................427 5.....................078........1/2................=39.................839..........................419Hope this clarifies my problem. Should I find the nearest bus and headoutof town? from JorgeCarcao@myna.com Wed Jul 21 19:41:28 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) Wed, 21 Jul 1999 20:41:07 -0400 Subject: Re: Bill Waara, Bamboo Icon Harry, Thanks for your kind words. Jorge Date: Wed, 21 Jul 1999 18:13:13 -0500From: Harry Boyd Cc: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Bill Waara, Bamboo Icon Jorge,Thank you for letting us know about Bill's death. Though we nevermet, I have fond feelings towards anyone as fascinated with bamboo asBillseems to have been. from what I have read, he must have been quite auniqueindividual. When the angling / bamboo fraternity loses one of itsbrighteststars, we all suffer a little. Please convey my thoughts and prayers totheWarra family as one who never met Bill, but cares and greives anyway.Harry Boyd Jorge Carcao wrote: To all those concerned, I have been asked to pass on some regrettable news. Yesterdayevening Bill Waara passed away. Bill, a Michigan native, had beenbuilding cane rods for over 50 years. Many of you folks have eithercome across some of his rodbuilding thoughts, ideas or techniques atthe various rodgatherings or through the Planing Form. John Longwrote a piece on his life in the Planing Form #44.met Bill in person. I would just like to add that Bill was a specialgentleman, knowledgable, generous, his sparkling good nature &sense of humor unequalled. Some of my fondest memories will be thosenights, when a group of us, huddled around Bill to talk bamboo. I trulywill miss him and cherish our friendship. The arrangements are as follows:Thayer-Rock Funeral Home33603 Grand River, Farmington Mich248-474-4131 Visitation: Thurs. 7-9 PMFri. 1-9 PM Funeral Sat. 11:00 AM Jorge from tklein@amgen.com Wed Jul 21 20:44:45 1999 smtp.amgen.com via smap (3.2) Subject: George... I'll probably get hammered for this, but I've got to get it off my chest... George is at it again in rec.outdoors.fishing.fly. He's got a thread goingwith several people who are defending todays bamboo rodmakers againstGeorge's earlier claim that todays makers are basically ripping off thepublic with their high priced rods. George is bunkering down andapparentlyhas no intention of apologizing. excerpt: George Gehrke - 1/20/98"...there isn't a bamboo fly rod today that can't be built for less than$100 dollars in materials and workmanship. The rest of the retail pricesisblue sky, like it or not. If the truth be known, the amount of materialsfound in a bamboo will be around $50! It depends upon volume and/orproduction and equipment available. I will say this. In my mind and fromalife time of actual bamboo experience, there isn't a bamboo fly rod madetoday that can be justified to retail over $250 - $300 like it or not and itdoesn't matter IF your name is Orvis or Mr. One @ A Time Rod Company..." Considering his above statement that there "...isn't a bamboo flyrod madetoday that can be justified to retail over $250 - $300...", I'd have to sayGeorge is ripping off the public with his $440.00 three piece rod. Add in the amount of help he got from various "Mr. One @ A Time RodCompanies", and you'd think the man would just admit that he was wrong! Not George. With his ego, you'd think he could use the fact that he proved HIMSELFwrongto his advantage. On the other hand, it looks like the question about whether somebody likeGeorge would hurt individual builders has been answered. I haven't seenanyone that feels the price of handmade rods as unreasonable. The onlypeople that are defending George are customers who are happy to get abamboorod that they can afford (I truly hope George doesn't disappoint them withashoddy product), but none that I've seen are knocking the prices charged byhand crafters. Don't get me wrong. I'm glad to see that SOMEBODY is making an effort tobring back production bamboo rodmaking. It's long overdue in my opinion.Unfortunately, George just ain't what I was hoping for. I've seen many rodmakers list their rods (with extra tip, rod sock, & tube)in the $500.00 to $750.00 range. George is less experienced than any ofthese folks and brags about the fact that he uses cane that most of usthrowaway. A $588.00 tab for the same outfit is certainly not much of a bargain.If he goes the retail route, he's promised to raise those pricessubstantially. That would put them over the price of the high end Winstonand Scott graphites. Will anyone buy a "starter" bamboo rod for MORE thanthe price of a top of the line production graphite? I doubt it. It appears to me that George's escapade has been a failure. He may make alittle money for himself (though, from the sound of things, he's got a hellof a hole to dig himself out of first), but the well made, readily availablebamboo rod priced for the average fisherman didn't materialize. It lookslike plastic still has a stranglehold on the throne... (...though those of us on Rodmakers know that Bamboo is still the TRUEKING) Tim--- from jaquin@netsync.net Wed Jul 21 20:47:22 1999 Wed, 21 Jul 1999 21:47:16 -0400 Subject: Re: heat guns again Bill Strelke wrote: John,The Milwaukee 2000-D heat gun works great for me. Variableadjustment knobgoes smoothly from cold to flame thrower.Bill ----- Original Message -----From: John J. Allison Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 1999 1:08 PMSubject: heat guns again Hi all, I've reviewed the archives about heat guns.The consensus seemed to be that the Sears Prowas a good gun. However, my local Sears salestrontells me they don't carry heat guns and sears.com makesno mention of them either. (They have a Heat Gun categorybut it is filled with power hammers. No heat guns in thehammer section. ;) The archives also reveal that the Sears Pro was made Hardware Store" has a Bosch 1942 for $90 on closeout(last one left as they've gone to Wagner and Porter-Cable).I might be able to bargain a bit more. Is the Bosch 1942 a good unit? bosch.com says nothing aboutit or any gun except the 1943 LED has a parts schematic. A deja.com search also didn't turn up much. John Allisonjohn@joss.ucar.eduBoulder, Colorado hi john, like Bill, I use a milwauke and, its given me good service. jerry from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Wed Jul 21 22:31:13 1999 Thu, 22 Jul 1999 11:23:28 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au) Ashton Olson ,Barbara Cadmus ,"Bucher, Julia" ,"Dale, Diana" ,George Sharpe ,Gwen Rivas , Jeane Baltzersen,John Barrett , John Cadmus ,Judy Bucher , Kim Sayers,Keith Dale , Lori Lohman ,Mark Metcalf , Pat Manginelli,Raleigh Koch ,Rodmakers , Teddy Dale,Thurmond & Whitney Moore ,Timmy Holmes Subject: Re: [Fwd: Fwd: Warning..........Virus] This is just another hoax, forget it. Tony On Wed, 21 Jul 1999, Jack Dale wrote: /***********************************************************************/ Q. How many Microsoft personel does it take to change a light bulb? A. None. They change the new standard to "Darkness" Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.html /***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Wed Jul 21 22:35:44 1999 Thu, 22 Jul 1999 11:35:20 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au) Subject: Re: clicking ferule Most likely the male has been reduced too much at the leading edge andit's what's clicking. Try placing the female section into the chuck ofyour lathe and slightly squeezing it to reduce it's diameter.It's an oldie but a goodie. Tony On Wed, 21 Jul 1999, Robert Venneri wrote: We just finished our first rod and it really looks good. It seems tocast good too. The only thing is there is a damn clicking at theferrule. Is there any way to fix this without repacing everything. Theclick is metal to metal. Being a machinest I should have done ok there. Best RegardsBob VVenneri's21 Chuck Hill Rdsaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882 /***********************************************************************/ Q. How many Microsoft personel does it take to change a light bulb? A. None. They change the new standard to "Darkness" Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.html /***********************************************************************/ from Canerods@aol.com Wed Jul 21 23:20:09 1999 Subject: Re: clicking ferule In a message dated 7/21/99 8:41:10 PM Pacific Daylight Time, tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au writes: Most likely the male has been reduced too much at the leading edge andit's what's clicking. Try placing the female section into the chuck ofyour lathe and slightly squeezing it to reduce it's diameter.It's an oldie but a goodie. Tony Tony, I've found that working on the male ferrule is easier and works just aswell. Don Burns from dpeaston@wzrd.com Thu Jul 22 08:37:05 1999 Subject: Another Old Rod Identification Question List, Does anyone out there know of a Rod designated in script as "Admiral #10"Impregnated Tonkin Cane Registered #----- ? I thought it might be one ofthe many H&I rods or a Wright&McGill "trade rod." However it doesn't seemto be so. Thanks in advance, Doug EastonTonawanda, NY from ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil Thu Jul 22 09:31:21 1999 1.redstone.army.mil Subject: FW: George... -----Original Message----- Subject: RE: George... Tim, As an absolute amateur and relative newcomer to bamboo.......yea,verily; George is "wrong" but let us give credit where credit is due.George is putting his money and effort where his mouth is... somethingdamnfew of us ever do...... The proof of the pudding will be how well his rodswork and stand up. We all know that reality will kick in and George willprobably end up having to charge $500+ for his rods to keep things viable.And that is just fine; if someone can get a half decent bamboo rod on themarket for about $500 it will feed the very real increase in bamboo usage.The more folks out there using bamboo, the bigger potential for thecustommaker. Will it drive prices down? Maybe, but let's be realistic, how big amarket is there for $1500- 2000 rods? Probably pretty limited, but itwillalways be there. George may be eccentric, but that is just what fueled a lot of greatenterprises, and a greater number of busts.......................... But heis doing it, so what difference the rhetoric??? Just another viewpoint....................... -----Original Message----- Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 1999 9:45 PM Subject: George... I'll probably get hammered for this, but I've got to get itoff my chest... George is at it again in rec.outdoors.fishing.fly. He's gota thread goingwith several people who are defending todays bamboorodmakers againstGeorge's earlier claim that todays makers are basicallyripping off thepublic with their high priced rods. George is bunkering downand apparentlyhas no intention of apologizing. rant, here is oneexcerpt: George Gehrke - 1/20/98"...there isn't a bamboo fly rod today that can't be built $100 dollars in materials and workmanship. The rest of theretail prices isblue sky, like it or not. If the truth be known, the amountof materialsfound in a bamboo will be around $50! It depends uponvolume and/orproduction and equipment available. I will say this. In mymind and from alife time of actual bamboo experience, there isn't a bamboofly rod madetoday that can be justified to retail over $250 - $300 likeit or not and itdoesn't matter IF your name is Orvis or Mr. One @ A Time RodCompany..." Considering his above statement that there "...isn't abamboo flyrod madetoday that can be justified to retail over $250 - $300...",I'd have to sayGeorge is ripping off the public with his $440.00 threepiece rod. Add in the amount of help he got from various "Mr. One @ ATime RodCompanies", and you'd think the man would just admit that hewas wrong! Not George. With his ego, you'd think he could use the fact that heproved HIMSELF wrongto his advantage. On the other hand, it looks like the question about whethersomebody likeGeorge would hurt individual builders has been answered. Ihaven't seenanyone that feels the price of handmade rods asunreasonable. The onlypeople that are defending George are customers who are happyto get a bamboorod that they can afford (I truly hope George doesn'tdisappoint them with ashoddy product), but none that I've seen are knocking theprices charged byhand crafters. Don't get me wrong. I'm glad to see that SOMEBODY is makingan effort tobring back production bamboo rodmaking. It's long overdue inmy opinion.Unfortunately, George just ain't what I was hoping for. I've seen many rodmakers list their rods (with extra tip,rod sock, & tube)in the $500.00 to $750.00 range. George is less experiencedthan any ofthese folks and brags about the fact that he uses cane thatmost of us throwaway. A $588.00 tab for the same outfit is certainly notmuch of a bargain.If he goes the retail route, he's promised to raise thosepricessubstantially. That would put them over the price of thehigh end Winstonand Scott graphites. Will anyone buy a "starter" bamboo rod the price of a top of the line production graphite? I doubtit. It appears to me that George's escapade has been a failure.He may make alittle money for himself (though, from the sound of things,he's got a hellof a hole to dig himself out of first), but the well made,readily availablebamboo rod priced for the average fisherman didn'tmaterialize. It lookslike plastic still has a stranglehold on the throne... (...though those of us on Rodmakers know that Bamboo isstill the TRUE KING) Tim--- from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Thu Jul 22 11:11:25 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) Thu, 22 Jul 1999 11:11:17 -0500 Rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: clicking ferule Don,What kind of work on the male? I've heard Dave LeClair talk aboutnickelplating. How else do you "adding metal" back to the male?Harry Canerods@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 7/21/99 8:41:10 PM Pacific Daylight Time,tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au writes: Most likely the male has been reduced too much at the leading edge andit's what's clicking. Try placing the female section into the chuck ofyour lathe and slightly squeezing it to reduce it's diameter.It's an oldie but a goodie. Tony Tony, I've found that working on the male ferrule is easier and works just aswell. Don Burns from tklein@amgen.com Thu Jul 22 11:28:18 1999 smtp.amgen.com via smap (3.2) Subject: RE: George... I think you've misunderstood me. I was hoping George would succeed! It'sjust my opinion that he hasn't. His rods have creeped up in price over his boastful claim that NO bamboorodtoday could justify more than a $250.00 to $300.00 price tag. His ownrods,using material that most of us throw out, come in at more than thatwithouteven a rodsock! Also, keep in mind that these are George's special rodsthathe's manufacturing right now. This is his first 100 batch that he'scharginga massive premium on, so somebody is paying a lot of money for a rod by arank amateur using our scraps. With the corners he's cut on "special" rodsthat he's charging as much as $4,444.44 for, what do you think he might dowhen he gets down to the $330.00 rods? Still, I do admire the fact that he tried and succeeded in setting up aproduction rod facility (even though he still hasn't actually shipped arod). His web documented tribulations have been interesting to watch, andmaybe the next person who tries to establish a production bamboo rodcompanycan even learn from George's experiences. Lastly, it still galls me that the man did all but call todays rodmakerscrooks for the prices they charge, then had to recruit many of those samemakers to help him get running, and today is claiming he has been 100%successful and denies his own original words. ----------From: Shuey Ralph[SMTP:ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil] Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 8:29 AM Subject: FW: George... Tim, As an absolute amateur and relative newcomer to bamboo.......yea,verily; George is "wrong" but let us give credit where credit is due.George is putting his money and effort where his mouth is... somethingdamnfew of us ever do...... The proof of the pudding will be how well his rodswork and stand up. We all know that reality will kick in and George willprobably end up having to charge $500+ for his rods to keep things viable.And that is just fine; if someone can get a half decent bamboo rod on themarket for about $500 it will feed the very real increase in bamboousage.The more folks out there using bamboo, the bigger potential for thecustommaker. Will it drive prices down? Maybe, but let's be realistic, how bigamarket is there for $1500-2000 rods? Probably pretty limited, but itwillalways be there. George may be eccentric, but that is just what fueled a lot of greatenterprises, and a greater number of busts.......................... Butheis doing it, so what difference the rhetoric??? Just another viewpoint....................... from leroyt@involved.com Thu Jul 22 12:07:49 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61049U4500L450S0V35)with SMTP id com; Thu, 22 Jul 1999 10:07:51 -0700 Subject: Re: George... I will agree with what you are saying about George, the honeymoon is notover yet. Thought the prices for un-finished blanks was interesting andwillwait and see how things go. Sure has toned downed his rhetoric, see howlong that lasts. Leroy.----- Original Message ----- Subject: RE: George... I think you've misunderstood me. I was hoping George would succeed! It'sjust my opinion that he hasn't. His rods have creeped up in price over his boastful claim that NO bamboorodtoday could justify more than a $250.00 to $300.00 price tag. His ownrods,using material that most of us throw out, come in at more than thatwithouteven a rodsock! Also, keep in mind that these are George's special rodsthathe's manufacturing right now. This is his first 100 batch that he'scharginga massive premium on, so somebody is paying a lot of money for a rod byarank amateur using our scraps. With the corners he's cut on "special"rodsthat he's charging as much as $4,444.44 for, what do you think he mightdowhen he gets down to the $330.00 rods? Still, I do admire the fact that he tried and succeeded in setting up aproduction rod facility (even though he still hasn't actually shipped arod). His web documented tribulations have been interesting to watch,andmaybe the next person who tries to establish a production bamboo rodcompanycan even learn from George's experiences. Lastly, it still galls me that the man did all but call todays rodmakerscrooks for the prices they charge, then had to recruit many of thosesamemakers to help him get running, and today is claiming he has been 100%successful and denies his own original words. ----------From: Shuey Ralph[SMTP:ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil] Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 8:29 AM Subject: FW: George... Tim, As an absolute amateur and relative newcomer to bamboo.......yea,verily; George is "wrong" but let us give credit where credit is due.George is putting his money and effort where his mouth is... somethingdamnfew of us ever do...... The proof of the pudding will be how well hisrodswork and stand up. We all know that reality will kick in and Georgewillprobably end up having to charge $500+ for his rods to keep thingsviable.And that is just fine; if someone can get a half decent bamboo rod onthemarket for about $500 it will feed the very real increase in bamboousage.The more folks out there using bamboo, the bigger potential for thecustommaker. Will it drive prices down? Maybe, but let's be realistic, howbigamarket is there for $1500-2000 rods? Probably pretty limited, but itwillalways be there. George may be eccentric, but that is just what fueled a lot of greatenterprises, and a greater number of busts.......................... Butheis doing it, so what difference the rhetoric??? Just another viewpoint....................... from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Thu Jul 22 12:08:08 1999 Fri, 23 Jul 1999 01:07:17 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au) Subject: RE: George... George *is* in politics....isn't he? Tony On Thu, 22 Jul 1999, Klein, Tim wrote: I think you've misunderstood me. I was hoping George would succeed! It'sjust my opinion that he hasn't. His rods have creeped up in price over his boastful claim that NO bamboorodtoday could justify more than a $250.00 to $300.00 price tag. His ownrods,using material that most of us throw out, come in at more than thatwithouteven a rodsock! Also, keep in mind that these are George's special rodsthathe's manufacturing right now. This is his first 100 batch that he'scharginga massive premium on, so somebody is paying a lot of money for a rod byarank amateur using our scraps. With the corners he's cut on "special"rodsthat he's charging as much as $4,444.44 for, what do you think he mightdowhen he gets down to the $330.00 rods? Still, I do admire the fact that he tried and succeeded in setting up aproduction rod facility (even though he still hasn't actually shipped arod). His web documented tribulations have been interesting to watch,andmaybe the next person who tries to establish a production bamboo rodcompanycan even learn from George's experiences. Lastly, it still galls me that the man did all but call todays rodmakerscrooks for the prices they charge, then had to recruit many of thosesamemakers to help him get running, and today is claiming he has been 100%successful and denies his own original words. ----------From: Shuey Ralph[SMTP:ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil] Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 8:29 AM Subject: FW: George... Tim, As an absolute amateur and relative newcomer to bamboo.......yea,verily; George is "wrong" but let us give credit where credit is due.George is putting his money and effort where his mouth is... somethingdamnfew of us ever do...... The proof of the pudding will be how well his rodswork and stand up. We all know that reality will kick in and Georgewillprobably end up having to charge $500+ for his rods to keep thingsviable.And that is just fine; if someone can get a half decent bamboo rod onthemarket for about $500 it will feed the very real increase in bamboousage.The more folks out there using bamboo, the bigger potential for thecustommaker. Will it drive prices down? Maybe, but let's be realistic, howbigamarket is there for $1500-2000 rods? Probably pretty limited, but itwillalways be there. George may be eccentric, but that is just what fueled a lot of greatenterprises, and a greater number of busts.......................... Butheis doing it, so what difference the rhetoric??? Just another viewpoint....................... /***********************************************************************/ Q. How many Microsoft personel does it take to change a light bulb? A. None. They change the new standard to "Darkness" Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.html /***********************************************************************/ from john@joss.ucar.edu Thu Jul 22 12:16:33 1999 Subject: RE: heat guns again Thanks all, with Tim's part # I was able to place an order.I even managed to find it on sears.com - search for "heat gun"via the "Find It" link on the main page; do not search or followlinks from the Tools section. In the meantime, I'd checked out a few other web sites (digi- key.com,mcmaster.com, and some others). I agree with the list'searlier conclusions that the Sears gun is a good all-around value,assuming it works as well as you all say it does ;) I'll be using the gun for other purposes this summer and thenfinally this fall start building. Target is to catch a fish ona dry fly with a cane rod on Jan 1! John Allisonjohn@joss.ucar.edu from ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil Thu Jul 22 13:20:38 1999 "'rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu'" Subject: RE: George... I will have to admit that I may have misunderstood some of your point. Butthere is still the point to be made that if we were all held 100%accountable for what we said over the years we would really look like tell me. I guess bamboo is what is important in this venue and it wouldappear that in the end he may help more than he will harm? As aproductionengineer in aerospace activities a lot of what he says makes sense. Hemaynot have his dollars and cents exactly right, and he has obviously ruffledsome feathers in the community, but by God he is building rods! I for onewould love to try one out and see just how well it compares to myproductionand custom rods. Like someone else said; "The proof of the pudding is in the eating...." -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 12:28 PM Subject: RE: George... I think you've misunderstood me. I was hoping George wouldsucceed! It'sjust my opinion that he hasn't. His rods have creeped up in price over his boastful claimthat NO bamboo rodtoday could justify more than a $250.00 to $300.00 pricetag. His own rods,using material that most of us throw out, come in at morethan that withouteven a rodsock! Also, keep in mind that these are George'sspecial rods thathe's manufacturing right now. This is his first 100 batchthat he's charginga massive premium on, so somebody is paying a lot of money rank amateur using our scraps. With the corners he's cut on"special" rodsthat he's charging as much as $4,444.44 for, what do youthink he might dowhen he gets down to the $330.00 rods? Still, I do admire the fact that he tried and succeeded insetting up aproduction rod facility (even though he still hasn'tactually shipped arod). His web documented tribulations have been interestingto watch, andmaybe the next person who tries to establish a productionbamboo rod companycan even learn from George's experiences. Lastly, it still galls me that the man did all but calltodays rodmakerscrooks for the prices they charge, then had to recruit manyof those samemakers to help him get running, and today is claiming he hasbeen 100%successful and denies his own original words. ----------From: ShueyRalph[SMTP:ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil] Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 8:29 AM Subject: FW: George... Tim, As an absolute amateur and relative newcomer tobamboo.......yea,verily; George is "wrong" but let us give credit wherecredit is due.George is putting his money and effort where his mouthis... somethingdamnfew of us ever do...... The proof of the pudding will behow well his rodswork and stand up. We all know that reality will kick inand George willprobably end up having to charge $500+ for his rods tokeep things viable.And that is just fine; if someone can get a half decentbamboo rod on themarket for about $500 it will feed the very real increasein bamboo usage.The more folks out there using bamboo, the biggerpotential for the custommaker. Will it drive prices down? Maybe, but let's berealistic, how bigamarket is there for $1500-2000 rods? Probably prettylimited, but it willalways be there. George may be eccentric, but that is just whatfueled a lot of greatenterprises, and a greater number ofbusts.......................... Butheis doing it, so what difference the rhetoric??? Just another viewpoint....................... from angelruten@smile.ch Thu Jul 22 13:51:43 1999 (MET DST) Subject: Gehrke - the bandwith Dear Friends since months i read your story about Gehrke an the always growingbandwith. Like i said in an earlier mail, G. hast the right to makecheap bamboo rods, there are angler who dram about fishing bamboo, butthe bucks are not enough to buy one.Here in Europe we have also a rodmaker who makes "cheap bamboo rods",cheap in price and fittings, the blanks is very well made.All the other ( and here there are only few bamboo rodmakers) talk "badthings" about this guy, but many of them order his blanks and reelseats,building only "her rods" and sell them for a much higher price - awfull,not? As a semi-prof rodmaker my "cheapest rod" , a 7ft, 2-pc #5 comes to ca.500 $, excl. tube, inc. bag. And - there is a (small) market for thisrods. Why not - the fishermans say what the wanna pay for (or can) - butmost of my custom rods are ca. 800 $, and there is also a market. I talked a lot with flyfishing-store-owners, and the said me from aeuropean dealers sight, the could not have Winston Rods for $ 3000 instock - for this price there`s no market here,and - they like to talk and deal with a native rodmaker - the same iheard from anglers here - interesting. Stefan --Lang Info AccessDatenbanken - CD Rom - InternetliteraturInternet: http://www.buchlang.com/infoaccess/Stefan GrauInformation ConsultantMènzgraben 2CH-3011 Berne/SwitzerlandPhone: 031 310 84 84direct phone: ++41 ( 0 ) 31 310 84 78fax: 310 84 94ausgenommen:Montag vormittag,Dienstag nachmittagMittwoch ganzer Tag---------------------------------------------------------------Sicherheits-Hinweis: Diese elektronische Post ist nur fèr den oder die Empf€nger, welchein der Adress-Zeile genannt werden bestimmt!Falls Sie nicht zu diesen gehåren, verståsst jede- unerlaubte Kopie,- unerlaubte Weiterleitung,- unerlaubte Kenntnisnahme, auch vermutlich oeffentlicher Inhalte,- und unerlaubte Verbreitung der enthaltenen Nachricht(en),sowie jeder anderer unautorisierte Gebrauch gegen geltendes Recht. Falls Sie nicht zu den in der Adresszeile genannten Empf€nger(n)gehåren,so bitten wir Sie um Kontaktnahme des Absenders und Zerstårungder betreffenden Daten von Ihrem Computer._________________________________________ Security-Note: The information transmitted is intended only for the personor entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidentialand/or privileged material.Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, ortaking of any action in reliance upon, this information bypersons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited.If you received this in error, please contact the sender and deletethe material from any computer. from hexagon@odyssee.net Thu Jul 22 17:08:54 1999 Subject: Re: George... Do not take George too seriously. For the price he is marketing his rods athecannot afford the one page adds in flyfishing mags or the colour brochures.Heis using the internet and the lists to keep his name circulating whichcostsbugger all. He has not got a product out there as yet so he has to keep thepotsimmering by sniping at those that have. It is just marketing.I think he should have retired and enjoyed life instead of buying himself ajob.It will notbe that easy trying to sell a product with slash marks and glue lines, evenifyou market them as being desirable!Terryleroy teeple wrote: I will agree with what you are saying about George, the honeymoon is notover yet. Thought the prices for un-finished blanks was interesting andwillwait and see how things go. Sure has toned downed his rhetoric, see howlong that lasts. Leroy.----- Original Message -----From: Klein, Tim Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 9:27 AMSubject: RE: George... I think you've misunderstood me. I was hoping George would succeed!It'sjust my opinion that he hasn't. His rods have creeped up in price over his boastful claim that NObamboorodtoday could justify more than a $250.00 to $300.00 price tag. His ownrods,using material that most of us throw out, come in at more than thatwithouteven a rodsock! Also, keep in mind that these are George's special rodsthathe's manufacturing right now. This is his first 100 batch that he'scharginga massive premium on, so somebody is paying a lot of money for a rod rank amateur using our scraps. With the corners he's cut on "special"rodsthat he's charging as much as $4,444.44 for, what do you think he mightdowhen he gets down to the $330.00 rods? Still, I do admire the fact that he tried and succeeded in setting up aproduction rod facility (even though he still hasn't actually shipped arod). His web documented tribulations have been interesting to watch,andmaybe the next person who tries to establish a production bamboo rodcompanycan even learn from George's experiences. Lastly, it still galls me that the man did all but call todays rodmakerscrooks for the prices they charge, then had to recruit many of thosesamemakers to help him get running, and today is claiming he has been 100%successful and denies his own original words. ----------From: Shuey Ralph[SMTP:ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil] Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 8:29 AM Subject: FW: George... Tim, As an absolute amateur and relative newcomer to bamboo.......yea,verily; George is "wrong" but let us give credit where credit is due.George is putting his money and effort where his mouth is...somethingdamnfew of us ever do...... The proof of the pudding will be how well hisrodswork and stand up. We all know that reality will kick in and Georgewillprobably end up having to charge $500+ for his rods to keep thingsviable.And that is just fine; if someone can get a half decent bamboo rod onthemarket for about $500 it will feed the very real increase in bamboousage.The more folks out there using bamboo, the bigger potential for thecustommaker. Will it drive prices down? Maybe, but let's be realistic, howbigamarket is there for $1500-2000 rods? Probably pretty limited, butitwillalways be there. George may be eccentric, but that is just what fueled a lot of greatenterprises, and a greater number of busts.......................... Butheis doing it, so what difference the rhetoric??? Just another viewpoint....................... from briansr@point-net.com Thu Jul 22 18:35:58 1999 Subject: Gunsmith Someone on the list mentioned he was a gunsmith. Please e-mail me.TIA Brian from rvenneri@ulster.net Thu Jul 22 18:53:47 1999 Subject: clicking Thanks to all who responded. You guys are the best without you guys inever would have finished my first rod. And a very special thanks toBrett reiter, Chris wolford, Jon linvet you guys were the bigest help ofall. Now enough playing I have some reel seats to make. Best regardsBob VVenneri's21 Chuck hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882http://www.ulster.net/~rvenneri/index.html from channer@hubwest.com Thu Jul 22 19:19:24 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A5742B3E012A; Thu, 22 Jul 1999 18:21:08 MST Subject: George At the risk of keeping this thread alive longer than it deserves, i willhave to add my 2 cents worth. i have written and deleted about 6 repliestothese posts and it boils down to a big SO WHAT!! Montague rides again,BFD.There will always be a market for the bottom line, its a bottom lineworld.However, there will always be those that can recognize quality and arewilling to pay for it. I don't think South Bend and Daiwa and the rest ofthe K-Mart line are cutting into Sages sales too much and I don't thinkPayne and Leonard were too threated by Montague and H-I.Enough of that crap, anyone got a taper for an 8'5wt that can deliver a #22BWO in a high wind?John from flyh2o@worldnet.att.net Thu Jul 22 19:38:57 1999 mtiwmhc04.worldnet.att.net(InterMail v03.02.07.07 118-134) with SMTP Fri, 23 Jul 1999 00:38:22 +0000 Subject: Re: Sharpening Jigs Art..Found the site and the pics, but for the life of me can't figure it out.Haven't seen a guide that looks like that one either....do you have abrandname on the guide? Sharpening isn't one of my strong points or so Ithinkafter working away on my practice cane. At 01:54 PM 7/21/99 -0400, Art Port wrote:Greg,The best one I've seen so far (and the one I'm using) is one that ChrisBogart showed me. It's merely two pieces of plexiglass (generically) andthey're glued together to form one piece that is a sort of shelf. Ifthey're parallel, you don't really need a third to make sure the blade isperpendicular to the stone. You hold the jig's body against the end of theguide, stick the blade through your guide and out 'til it bottoms on theupper piece, lock up, and then set the guide so it's at the angle you wantit at, AND NEVER ADJUST THE GUIDE AGAIN (sorry, I don't have italics onthis Eudora). There's a picture of it at Chris' website (listed atRodmakers' page -- I can't find the URL to save my neck right now). I usearotation of 5 planes and I sharpen them all at once, all 5 on one grit ofsandpaper, then all 5 on the next, etc., and I have NEVER had suchconsistent results from a system! The blades get sharper and they takelesstime to do since you're not re-establishing a new angle every time youthrow them in the guide.The only trick is in dedicating the guide to your cane work or gettinganother guide if you use different angles for different planes. Once youreadjust the guide, your jig is DOO-DOO!Have fun,Art Mike Leitheiser "When the trout are lost, smash the state."Tom McGuane from ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil Thu Jul 22 20:23:52 1999 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: George John; You are exactly right! If, and it may be a big if, bamboo is tobecome a major factor on the market again, all segments of that marketmustbe addressed. The bottom line has always generated the market for theuppersegments. Without that bottom line there probably wouldn't be a customerbase to move up to the mid level product, etc., etc. That's why it's calledan economic SYSTEM. If George equals Montegue, and succeeds, can SouthBendand Granger be far behind? Damn!!! isn't this a great country? -----Original Message----- Subject: George At the risk of keeping this thread alive longer than it deserves, i willhave to add my 2 cents worth. i have written and deleted about 6 repliestothese posts and it boils down to a big SO WHAT!! Montague rides again,BFD.There will always be a market for the bottom line, its a bottom lineworld.However, there will always be those that can recognize quality and arewilling to pay for it. I don't think South Bend and Daiwa and the rest ofthe K-Mart line are cutting into Sages sales too much and I don't thinkPayne and Leonard were too threated by Montague and H-I.Enough of that crap, anyone got a taper for an 8'5wt that can deliver a #22BWO in a high wind?John from mrmac@tcimet.net Thu Jul 22 20:31:39 1999 Subject: Blowtorch for flaming? Hello, all. I'm finally in the process of rod one (a Sir D), a littlebehind Doc and with the advice I've picked up from the list, it'sactually coming together in reasonable order. As a newbie to thingsoffering the suggestion to others about to begin, the best tip so far isthe advice about bending the fat part when splitting the culm whichrecently appeared. It made all the difference between the struggle ofthe butt half and piece of cake it was on the tip half of the culm. So, things are proceeding so well, I'm looking ahead to #2, and want todo it flamed. As I've been keeping my eye open for planes in theantique malls, I've run across a couple of the old fashioned blowtorchesthat seemed reasonably priced, and somewhat appropriate in "vintage" forthe process. My question is whether anyone has used these and if theyare OK for the purpose, or if they would be too awkward/heavy. Whetherthey are hotter ( and is that good?) than the propane types is alsosomething that I'm unsure of. What's the right fuel - gasoline,kerosene, or something else? Any suggestions would be appreciated, and thanks for all the help sofar. mac from darrelll@earthlink.net Thu Jul 22 20:52:52 1999 Subject: Nuthin' like a little homegrown... boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0026_01BED473.621C4520" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01BED473.621C4520 Here's a article you'all might find interesting... http://www.rodbuilding.com/main/cane/index.html enjoy darrell ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01BED473.621C4520 Here's a article you'all might interesting... http://www.rodbu=ilding.com/main/cane/index.html enjoy darrell ------=_NextPart_000_0026_01BED473.621C4520-- from LECLAIR123@aol.com Thu Jul 22 21:07:55 1999 Subject: Re: Finish RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 7/19/99 11:27:00 PM Pacific Daylight Time, DBurrill@telehub.net writes: Dean, I use Man-o-War spar varnish. I thin it withmineral spirits . Around 70% spar and 30% thinner. I don'tthin the last coat Dave from hexagon@odyssee.net Thu Jul 22 21:38:46 1999 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: George What the hell is wrong with a Wes Jordan South Bend rod? I have an oldSouthbend and I would rather fish with that than a copy of a Garrison taper.Try taking a close look at an old production rod especially the the canework.All they really lack is the fancy hardware and the multi layers of actiondeadening plastic.Companies like South bend and Granger built some really good rods andthey solda lot of them and were successful in the fact that they made money.Most rodmaker get a reputation on the rods they build, but George has goneforthe reputation first, which is interesting. But at least he is building ithimself and not buying a name. He is a rod maker and I cannot understandwhysome of you guys do not like the mention of him on the list. The man isopinionated, but no more than the guy on the list that thinks that a canerodonly qualifies as being good if it is hand planed and expensiveTerry "Shuey, Ralph" wrote: John; You are exactly right! If, and it may be a big if, bamboo is tobecome a major factor on the market again, all segments of that marketmustbe addressed. The bottom line has always generated the market for theuppersegments. Without that bottom line there probably wouldn't be acustomerbase to move up to the mid level product, etc., etc. That's why it's calledan economic SYSTEM. If George equals Montegue, and succeeds, can SouthBendand Granger be far behind? Damn!!! isn't this a great country? -----Original Message----- Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 7:20 PM Subject: George At the risk of keeping this thread alive longer than it deserves, i willhave to add my 2 cents worth. i have written and deleted about 6 repliestothese posts and it boils down to a big SO WHAT!! Montague ridesagain,BFD.There will always be a market for the bottom line, its a bottom lineworld.However, there will always be those that can recognize quality and arewilling to pay for it. I don't think South Bend and Daiwa and the rest ofthe K-Mart line are cutting into Sages sales too much and I don't thinkPayne and Leonard were too threated by Montague and H-I.Enough of that crap, anyone got a taper for an 8'5wt that can deliver a#22BWO in a high wind?John from miler257@gateway.net Thu Jul 22 21:40:17 1999 Subject: crooked strips boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BED48B.538ACAA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BED48B.538ACAA0 I have a question for the list. I am working on some strips for my =latest project, a Young Perfectionist, and I noticed that a couple of =the strips are twisted after a node. My question: are these "bad" strips =or can they reasonably be straightened?I do have another culm that I could split and use.Is it worth investing = "kinky" ones? Thanks for any suggestions, Ed Miller. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BED48B.538ACAA0 I have a question for the list. I am= some strips for my latest project, a Young Perfectionist, and I noticed = "bad" strips or can they reasonably be =straightened?I do have another culm that Icould = use.Is it worth investing the time on the "kinky" ones? Thanks for any suggestions,= Miller. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BED48B.538ACAA0-- from hexagon@odyssee.net Thu Jul 22 21:43:33 1999 Subject: Re: Nuthin' like a little homegrown... boundary="------------6279DF8F688E66B78A3F5AF4" --------------6279DF8F688E66B78A3F5AF4 I think I would be more inclined to try to grow cork Darrell Lee wrote: Here's a article you'all might findinteresting... http://www.rodbuilding.com/main/cane/index.html enjoydarrell --------------6279DF8F688E66B78A3F5AF4 Darrell Lee wrote: --------------6279DF8F688E66B78A3F5AF4-- from weehughie@home.com Thu Jul 22 22:03:07 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.07 201-229-111-110) with SMTP 0700 Subject: RE: George... George reacted very interestingly after he read an article I wrote called'The Day Gink Caused A Stink'.http://flyfishing.about.com/library/weekly/aa060299.htm I had a lot of fun with that :). I did have to remind him that the word'Gink' is still common usage in some parts of Ireland and has been around alot longer than his product and in fact, it was a nickname of mine beforehis Gink appeared on store shelves. Ian Scott from drodgers@ddaccess.net Fri Jul 23 08:19:22 1999 ddasvr1.ddaccess.comwith SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2232.9) Subject: Comments boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01BED4EC.6CC3E360" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01BED4EC.6CC3E360 Gentlemen and ladies, Having read all of the many postings regarding Mr. George , I feel that =I have to say something. What strikes me the most is that Mr. George is =criticizing the very folks that he is asking to help him. This lack of =respect is distrubing and shocking. I don't care if a rodmaker is making =one or a hundred rods, for a few dollars or thousands dollars. We are =all friends and part of the rodmakers fraternity and/or profession. =Whether we are making a single or or have production line, we nor him =should be knocking the others in the field. Dan ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01BED4EC.6CC3E360 Gentlemen andladies, Having read all of the manypostings = Mr. George , I feel that I have to say something. What strikes me the = that Mr. George is criticizing the very folks that he is asking to help = This lack of respect is distrubing and shocking. I don't care if a = making one or a hundred rods, for a few dollars or thousands dollars. We = are making a single or or have production line, we nor him should be = the others in the field. Dan ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01BED4EC.6CC3E360-- from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Fri Jul 23 09:31:59 1999 0400 Subject: RE: clicking ..I was gonna say, when I am ready for my next real seat I hope you'll havethem available!!I agree with you, this list really helped me get my first (and so far only)roddone.... -----Original Message----- Subject: clicking Thanks to all who responded. You guys are the best without you guys inever would have finished my first rod. And a very special thanks toBrett reiter, Chris wolford, Jon linvet you guys were the bigest help ofall. Now enough playing I have some reel seats to make. Best regardsBob VVenneri's21 Chuck hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882http://www.ulster.net/~rvenneri/index.html from jackdale@uswest.net Fri Jul 23 11:32:50 1999 (206.196.156.235) Subject: Re: George Channer,Point well taken. One of the surest ways to catch bamboo fever is to shellouta modest piece of hard-earned cash for a Montague and to savor the look,elegance, and ooooh-factor of bamboo and then to realize that your prizedrodcasts like a broomstick. Nothing puts the high price of quality bamboointo avery clear perspective like a bad case of The Wants.Jack channer wrote: At the risk of keeping this thread alive longer than it deserves, i willhave to add my 2 cents worth. i have written and deleted about 6 repliestothese posts and it boils down to a big SO WHAT!! Montague ridesagain,BFD.There will always be a market for the bottom line, its a bottom lineworld.However, there will always be those that can recognize quality and arewilling to pay for it. I don't think South Bend and Daiwa and the rest ofthe K-Mart line are cutting into Sages sales too much and I don't thinkPayne and Leonard were too threated by Montague and H-I.Enough of that crap, anyone got a taper for an 8'5wt that can deliver a#22BWO in a high wind?John from hexagon@odyssee.net Fri Jul 23 12:53:18 1999 Subject: Re: George Bamboo is bamboo and the difference between rods are taper and hardwearand it ispossible to purchase a cheap vintage rod that casts better than a moderncomputergenerated wonder! What would be the difference in the casting ability of one of Mr G'sDickersontaper machine made $400 rods and a hand planed $1500 Dickerson copy?They wouldboth be made from a lump of $10 cane.The cost of a cane rod has nothing to do with its casting ability, youare paying buildersperceived value of what the product is worth.If George can put out some good casting rods that look half decent hewill have amarket that will not encroach on the builders of this list because allof you makerods with a higher perceived value than a Bastard.Terry Jack Dale wrote: Channer,Point well taken. One of the surest ways to catch bamboo fever is toshell outa modest piece of hard-earned cash for a Montague and to savor the look,elegance, and ooooh-factor of bamboo and then to realize that yourprized rodcasts like a broomstick. Nothing puts the high price of quality bamboointo avery clear perspective like a bad case of The Wants.Jack channer wrote: At the risk of keeping this thread alive longer than it deserves, i willhave to add my 2 cents worth. i have written and deleted about 6replies tothese posts and it boils down to a big SO WHAT!! Montague ridesagain,BFD.There will always be a market for the bottom line, its a bottom lineworld.However, there will always be those that can recognize quality and arewilling to pay for it. I don't think South Bend and Daiwa and the rest ofthe K-Mart line are cutting into Sages sales too much and I don't thinkPayne and Leonard were too threated by Montague and H-I.Enough of that crap, anyone got a taper for an 8'5wt that can deliver a#22BWO in a high wind?John from sniderja@email.uc.edu Fri Jul 23 14:32:47 1999 Subject: Tormek Sharpening device Wonder if any of you rodmakers, especially those of you who dowoodworkingAND rodbuilding, have ever used the Tormek power sharpening machine? Iknowit is pricey, but I have an opportunity to purchase one at a very decentprice (with many attachments, etc.) from an estate sale. Any advice?J. Snider from rp43640@online-club.de Fri Jul 23 15:57:51 1999 Fri, 23 Jul 1999 22:57:45 +0200 (METDST) Subject: Re: Tormek Sharpening device A friend and fellow rodmaker uses a tormek. If you ever consider buyingone only their bigger model is suitable. Otherwise you are able to getyour blades sharpened very well.One disadvantage so the device for holding the plane blade has to beadjusted and the stone is very soft so you probably have to dress thestone from time to time. o my knowledge there was also a test of thistype of machines in a recent edition of fine woodworking. regards Christian Wonder if any of you rodmakers, especially those of you who dowoodworkingAND rodbuilding, have ever used the Tormek power sharpening machine? Iknowit is pricey, but I have an opportunity to purchase one at a very decentprice (with many attachments, etc.) from an estate sale. Any advice?J. Snider from dadwarbucks@earthlink.net Fri Jul 23 16:40:17 1999 Subject: e-mail I have asked several times to be removed from receiving any more of youre-mail. What needs to be done. from cattanac@wmis.net Fri Jul 23 16:53:16 1999 mail4.wmis.net(8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id RAA03732; Fri, 23 Jul 1999 17:53:05 -0400 Subject: Re: Blowtorch for flaming? Mac -I have used a blow torch a couple of time be for settling in on the lpunit I sue now - they are how enough but be cautious with the fuels thatyouuse - the blow torches that I used require white gas - I used Coleman fuel.What you will find is that each type of fuel with yeild a slightlydifferent brown tone - Payne used a gas fuel that is no longer available soto the perfectionist you would need to nake the gas to recreate the exactbrown tone.The LP gas torches I use became a personal choice - a little easier touse and a big issue - I had then and didn't need to lay out the cash. Aswith any other test I would recommend using a scrap culm to initially getthe techniques down - go for the gusto - the burnt marshmellow look -thatis perhaps the darkest that bamboo can be flamed - you can tell the speedofflaming is correct when the 1st layer(yes - there are two) of enamelfractures or explodes just as the torch pases over it. Good LuckWayne from HARMS1@prodigy.net Fri Jul 23 17:05:32 1999 Fri, 23 Jul 1999 18:05:27 -0400 Subject: Re: crooked strips boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0044_01BED535.BF5738E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0044_01BED535.BF5738E0 Ed,Do not worry about "crooked" strips. There are damn few that are not =crooked. Warm up your heat-gun and get about the business of =straightening. It takes a little time, of course, but it's all part of =the normal process. cheers, Bill-----Original Message-----From: miler257 Date: Thursday, July 22, 1999 7:43 PMSubject: crooked strips I have a question for the list. I am working on some strips for my =latest project, a Young Perfectionist, and I noticed that a couple of =the strips are twisted after a node. My question: are these "bad" strips =or can they reasonably be straightened?I do have another culm that I could split and use.Is it worth = "kinky" ones? Thanks for any suggestions, Ed Miller. ------=_NextPart_000_0044_01BED535.BF5738E0 Ed,Do not worry = process. Bill -----Original = rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= <rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu= stripsI have a question for the list. = on some strips for my latest project, a Young Perfectionist, and I = that a couple of the strips are twisted after a node. My question: = "bad" strips or can they reasonably be =straightened?I do have another culm that I = and use.Is it worth investing the time on the "kinky" ones? Thanks for any = Miller. ------=_NextPart_000_0044_01BED535.BF5738E0-- from darrelll@earthlink.net Fri Jul 23 17:18:54 1999 Subject: Does anyone sell a scarfing block? boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00E4_01BED51E.A8FDE7E0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00E4_01BED51E.A8FDE7E0 Inquiring minds want to know... ------=_NextPart_000_00E4_01BED51E.A8FDE7E0 know... ------=_NextPart_000_00E4_01BED51E.A8FDE7E0-- from joanne39@nidlink.com Fri Jul 23 17:22:18 1999 Subject: TAKE ME OFF YOUR LISTS11 from joanne39@nidlink.com Fri Jul 23 17:23:57 1999 Subject: STOP!!! Stop sending me other peoples conversations!!Take my name off your emaillists!! from anglport@con2.com Fri Jul 23 17:35:04 1999 Subject: Re: Does anyone sell a scarfing block? Maybe Jon Linvet? At 03:18 PM 7/23/99 -0700, Darrell Lee wrote:Inquiring minds want to know... from freaner@gte.net Fri Jul 23 17:54:48 1999 Subject: Re: e-mail At 5:42 PM -0500 on 7/23/99, Stan Auerbach wrote: I have asked several times to be removed from receiving any more of youre-mail. What needs to be done. Got to http://home1.gte.net/jfoster/ and look for the button labeled"Join/Resign RM" - you'll find complete instructions. Claude from rclarke@eou.edu Fri Jul 23 17:59:13 1999 -0700 "darrelll@earthlink.net",Rod Makers Subject: RE: Does anyone sell a scarfing block? I think Jon sells a very nice one. Robert Clarke -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Does anyone sell a scarfing block? Maybe Jon Linvet? At 03:18 PM 7/23/99 -0700, Darrell Lee wrote:Inquiring minds want to know... from freaner@gte.net Fri Jul 23 18:49:18 1999 Subject: Stanley Planes Would someone please tell me the differences between a Stanley 9 1/4planeand a Stanley 9 1/2 plane? The pictures I've seen appear the same. Thanks,Claude from rsgould@cmc.net Fri Jul 23 20:25:07 1999 Subject: Scarfing block Hi Darrell,I bought my scarfing block from the :Bamboo Rod Fly Shop415-525-165710254 San Pablo Ave.El Cerrito, CA 94530Ray from jjohnso4@bellsouth.net Fri Jul 23 21:50:38 1999 Subject: Re: Stanley Planes At 07:43 PM 7/23/99 -0400, Claude Freaner wrote:Would someone please tell me the differences between a Stanley 9 1/4planeand a Stanley 9 1/2 plane? The pictures I've seen appear the same. Thanks,Claude Hi Claude, Take a look at: http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan0.htm BTW, the 9 1/2 has an adjustable mouth - the 9 1/4 doesn't. Later,Johnny----------------------------------------------Johnny JohnsonLilburn, GA from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Fri Jul 23 22:49:38 1999 with ESMTP id +0000 Subject: [Fwd: clicking] 794FE6FAC458BA8CBCCCC4AD" This is a multi-part message in MIME format.-------------- 794FE6FAC458BA8CBCCCC4AD --------------794FE6FAC458BA8CBCCCC4AD Subject: Re: clicking I agree with both of you, But I use real reel seats. That's why I buy 'em from Bob! Nointerest, blah blah... Just great workmanship... Thanx for the thrill,Andy... Thanx for the seats, Bob! Hope to see you in PA, Dennis andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com wrote: ..I was gonna say, when I am ready for my next real seat I hope you'llhavethem available!!I agree with you, this list really helped me get my first (and so far only)roddone.... -----Original Message-----From: Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 7:54 PM Subject: clicking Thanks to all who responded. You guys are the best without you guys inever would have finished my first rod. And a very special thanks toBrett reiter, Chris wolford, Jon linvet you guys were the bigest help ofall. Now enough playing I have some reel seats to make. Best regardsBob VVenneri's21 Chuck hill RdSaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882http://www.ulster.net/~rvenneri/index.html -- I know I'm insane, but it's the only thing that keeps me from goingcrazy! --------------794FE6FAC458BA8CBCCCC4AD-- from dmanders@telusplanet.net Mon Jul 26 08:34:02 1999 don") bysmtp1.telusplanet.net with SMTP id ; Mon, 26 Jul 199906:36:04 - 0600 Subject: Test - Please ignore from Fdcm@aol.com Mon Jul 26 08:35:09 1999 Subject: Books for the Beginner All I have decided to make the plunge and attempt to build my first bamboo fly rod. The first challenge that I am facing is deciding which of the many books on the market are in fact worth purchasing. I'm not having muchluck with finding any to thumb through so I am sure I will have to order them. You comments would be greatly appreciated. ThanksJay from Grhghlndr@aol.com Mon Jul 26 08:35:24 1999 Subject: Atlantic salmon fishing rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu List,I talked to Brian from Montreal today and we got to talking about Atlantic salmon fishing. He and I got to wondering how many guys on the list areinto this type of fishing and thought maybe some of us could hook up nextseason Bret from johanyga@online.no Mon Jul 26 08:37:10 1999 Mon, 26 Jul 1999 00:16:12 +0200 (MET DST) Subject: SV: Hardy , CC De France Just a test. Am I in or out? Or is it the list slow?Johan Nygaardsvold--------- -Fra: Johan Nygördvold Til: iank@nelson.planet.org.nz; rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduEmne: SV: Hardy , CC De France Ian, I have got two C.C.de France rods, one 8 ft three piece, and one 9 ft twopiece. The ca. 1970 8 ft is not especially light, but the 9 ft rod islight compared to most English rods I presume. The 8 ft is for a DT 5 andthe 9 ft is designed for a DT 6. After consulting my Hardy catalogs from 1932 and 1953, it looks astheserods were primarely designed for competition casting. They are notmentioned in the 1963 catalog, and I have yet to see a 9'6'' in some ofmyother Hardy catalogs. I don't think they were hollow built. I once owned an 8'0'' Hollokona,andpresently I have a 9 ft Hollolight and I think Hardy always used theprefix"Hollo" on their hollowbuilt rods.I suppose the 9 ' 6'' were designed for a DT 7 line. regards Johan Nygaardsvold Ian Kearney Til: rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduEmne: Hardy , CC De France I picked up a very good condition 9'6" Hardy CC De France rod duringtheweek . It is much lighter then the traditional English rods . The rodwasmade in the early 1960's . Does any one have an idea of the weight oflinethese were designed for ? I can post the taper once i get around to measuring it if anyone isinterested . regards Ian Kearney from saweiss@flash.net Mon Jul 26 08:40:24 1999 Subject: join boundary="----=_NextPart_000_002B_01BED690.2185BCC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_002B_01BED690.2185BCC0 unsubscribe rodmakers ------=_NextPart_000_002B_01BED690.2185BCC0 unsubscribe =rodmakers ------=_NextPart_000_002B_01BED690.2185BCC0-- from Grhghlndr@aol.com Mon Jul 26 08:43:18 1999 Subject: Rod list rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu putting my list together and will send it to everyone when it is done.Bret from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Mon Jul 26 08:43:55 1999 Subject: test Hello is there anybody still on the list or am I off the list. I can't live without the list. HELP ME !!! it's been two days JOE from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Mon Jul 26 08:44:39 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id NAA08092; Mon, 26 Jul 1999 13:27:31 +1200 , , Subject: Re: SV: Hardy , CC De France Johan, I think the list server must be playing up . I have not had a message for 36hours and tried the usual unsubscribe .. resubscribe routine and got amessage back that the message could not be delivered for 4 hours . regards Ian Kearney At 12:14 AM 26/07/99 +0200, Johan Nygördvold wrote:Just a test. Am I in or out? Or is it the list slow?Johan Nygaardsvold---------- from Turbotrk@aol.com Mon Jul 26 08:45:06 1999 Subject: test This is a test of the emergency rodmaking network. I repeat this is only a test. from sats@gte.net Mon Jul 26 08:45:57 1999 Subject: A useful tool. Over the years I've built many tools. Many of them end in the trash can. AfewI keep on the workbench.This is one of them. I use it for final sanding, and I've modified one toclean out the v in a planing form. You'll need a 1x2" long enough to cut into 4 pieces. Three of the piecesarethe same length and the fourth is 1/4 the length of the other three. Rip the smaller piece so it's about 2/3 it's original with. Exact size isn'tcritical. Make a sandwich of the boards like this(looking down from the top): A-XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX full lengthXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXB- XXXshortXXX space C-XXXXXXXXXXXXXfull length XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXD- XXXXXXXXXXXXXXX full lengthXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX Drill a hole through the three full lengths pieces so that it passes Through the center of board "C." Pass a bolt through "A," "C" and "D." Attachthe small piece so that it's aligned with the back top of the tool. Roundoffthe edges of part "C." Now the critical part. The bottoms of "A," "C," and "D" must be flat. theBottom back angle of "A" and "D" must be Perpendicular to the flat bottom.piece "C" should be snug, so it doesn't wobble, but should be able to move. To use the tool, a piece of sandpaper, as wide as the center board, to thatboard. place the tool over the work so that the bottom back of eachoutsidepiece ("A" and "D") are flat on the work area and part "C" rests flat on thework. Now sand as you normally would. The two "outriggers" will holdyoursanding block square to the work. I've built a few of them. Shorter ones for coarse sandpaper and longerones forfine sandpaper. As I've said, I also glued a three sided file to one of these tools, to allowme to "Clean out" the V grove in a form. I'm sure that there's a way tobuildone that would hold a scraper, too. My two cents for the week. Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from Canerods@aol.com Mon Jul 26 08:55:31 1999 Subject: Test post List down? dgb from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Mon Jul 26 08:59:28 1999 (BST) boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01BED736.0E1F7120" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BED736.0E1F7120 Subscribe Rodmakers ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BED736.0E1F7120 Subscribe =Rodmakers ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01BED736.0E1F7120-- from djfinch@sprintmail.com Mon Jul 26 08:59:38 1999 WAA27177 Subject: test from leroyt@involved.com Mon Jul 26 09:00:52 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61049U4500L450S0V35)with SMTP id com; Sun, 25 Jul 1999 07:47:09 -0700 Subject: Re: Stanley Planes That is a very cool site.Leroy......----- Original Message ----- Subject: Re: Stanley Planes At 07:43 PM 7/23/99 -0400, Claude Freaner wrote:Would someone please tell me the differences between a Stanley 9 1/4planeand a Stanley 9 1/2 plane? The pictures I've seen appear the same. Thanks,Claude Hi Claude, Take a look at: http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan0.htm BTW, the 9 1/2 has an adjustable mouth - the 9 1/4 doesn't. Later,Johnny----------------------------------------------Johnny JohnsonLilburn, GA from leroyt@involved.com Mon Jul 26 09:00:58 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.5.3 release 223 ID# 0-61049U4500L450S0V35)with SMTP id com for ;Sun, 25 Jul 1999 12:40:12 -0700 Subject: slow boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01BED69B.75ED1820" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BED69B.75ED1820 Are we having a slow day ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BED69B.75ED1820 day ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BED69B.75ED1820-- from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Jul 26 09:11:09 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) 0500 Subject: dip tank motor Friends,The old rotisserie motor I've used on my diptank for the last three years is on its very last leg.Guess it's time to buy one of the fancy-dancy steppermotors from H&R that I've seen in some of your booksand referred to on Jerry's page as: -----Stepper motors for DIP TANKS TM93KIT2421 (kit) -----or TM93KIT2421/A (assembled unit) They alsohave power supplies. Here's my question: I am, shall we say,electronically challenged. What all do I need to buy(power supply?). Like I say, I'm ignorant, so I needspecifics, including part #'s, if you don't mind. I'malso not rich, so let's don't have any suggestions over$100 US. Thanks,Harry PS, how much re-wiring am I going to have to do? from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Jul 26 09:11:11 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) Sun, 25 Jul 1999 08:45:04 -0500 "rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu" Subject: Re: list Steve,I haven't sent a test message or anything, but I've receivednothing in 24 hours. Bet it's down. I sent a message yesterday afternoonthat hasn't appeared on my computer yet.Harry Steve Trauthwein wrote: Harry, I just sent a test message to the list and got a fatal error message from my server. Is the list down, or do I need to unsub and sub again?TIA. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from jfreeman@cyberport.com Mon Jul 26 09:11:20 1999 Subject: Re: Waterstones Mark, I agree with Dick. I've been using the "Scary Sharp" method and have nothad a lifted node. Don't have to flatten any stones either. Jim ----------From: dickfuhrman@rheemote.com Subject: WaterstonesDate: Tuesday, July 20, 1999 11:00 AM Mark,Have you looked at the "Scary Sharp" system? You don't have to worryabout flat stones with this system. Try:www.shavings.net/SCARY.HTM#original 2000 grit sandpaper is available in the automotive section at Wal-Mart.No connection to Wal-Mart except I seem to go there at least once aweek Keep it sharp!Dick Fuhrman from johanyga@online.no Mon Jul 26 09:13:20 1999 (MET DST) Subject: Test Test. Slow list, or am I out? Johan Nygaardsvold from johanyga@online.no Mon Jul 26 09:41:10 1999 (MET DST) Subject: Test Test.Slow list?Johan Nygaardsvold from rambo2_98@yahoo.com Mon Jul 26 09:48:20 1999 1999 10:48:47 EDT Subject: oven for sale I have an extra mica-strip, thermostat controlledelectric oven for sale. Contact me off-list if anyoneis interested. _________________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com from ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil Mon Jul 26 09:50:09 1999 1.redstone.army.mil Subject: Wayne Cattanach Tapers Good Morning All; I have just purchased a 6'6", 3wt rod from a young man in SouthAfrica, of all places. This was his second rod and it is based on WayneCattanach's taper listed "on the web". Assuming that he did everything correctly (why not?), what should Iexpect in the way of rod action? I realize this is all relative, and I'veput the cart before the horse, but at least I can have a baseline toevaluate the rod from, right? from my very limited knowledge of this business (I build Rockets forcrying out loud!) I note that Wayne's curves run somewhat differently thanmost others........ does that mean anything? Someone said that his smallrods are sort of Parabol"ish"? Being an engineer (no hissing please.....) how should I go aboutdetermining just what I've got when it gets here? What should I look/feel I have a Granger, Edwards, Hardy, and other "straight" rods so I'm familiarwith cane, I just figure if this is going to be different, I should beprepared. ThanksAll; Ralph Shuey from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Mon Jul 26 09:54:20 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) 0500 Subject: dip tank motors I sent this over the weekend, and either I've beenbumped off the list, or we've had server troubles. Ifthis is a repeat, sorry for the waste of bandwidth.Since I've been out of pocket, I missed any replies. Friends,The old rotisserie motor I've used on my diptank for the last three years is on its very last leg.Guess it's time to buy one of the fancy-dancy steppermotors from H&R that I've seen in some of your booksand referred to on Jerry's page as: -----Stepper motors for DIP TANKS TM93KIT2421 (kit) -----or TM93KIT2421/A (assembled unit) They alsohave power supplies. Here's my question: I am, shall we say,electronically challenged. What all do I need to buy(power supply?). Like I say, I'm ignorant, so I needspecifics, including part #'s, if you don't mind. I'malso not rich, so let's don't have any suggestions over $100 US. Thanks,Harry PS, how much re-wiring am I going to have to do? from dan_cooney@ibm.net Mon Jul 26 09:58:18 1999 out5.ibm.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA69620 for; Sun,25 Jul 1999 21:27:06 GMT Subject: Re: Test Test from gholland@navsys.com Mon Jul 26 09:58:24 1999 Steve Trauthwein, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: list I'm getting bombarded with messages.....it can't be down. Greg -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: list Steve,I haven't sent a test message or anything, but I've receivednothing in 24 hours. Bet it's down. I sent a message yesterday afternoonthat hasn't appeared on my computer yet.Harry Steve Trauthwein wrote: Harry, I just sent a test message to the list and got a fatal error message from my server. Is the list down, or do I need to unsub and sub again?TIA. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from gholland@navsys.com Mon Jul 26 09:59:56 1999 rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: Test You're in...... -----Original Message----- Subject: Test Test. Slow list, or am I out? Johan Nygaardsvold from watson@cape-consult.co.uk Mon Jul 26 10:10:39 1999 (BST) Subject: Test boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0006_01BED69E.AA053F40" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01BED69E.AA053F40 ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01BED69E.AA053F40 ------=_NextPart_000_0006_01BED69E.AA053F40-- from WLBond@cps-satx.com Mon Jul 26 10:17:50 1999 199915:21:58 UT Steve Trauthwein, rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu,"'gholland@navsys.com'" Subject: RE: list PLEASE Stop sending test messages. I've gotten more than a dozen in thelast hour. Leave it alone. Your server is probably full of test messages.Most only have a few gig for message info. ----------From: Greg Holland[SMTP:gholland@navsys.com] Sent: Monday, July 26, 1999 9:59 AM rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: list I'm getting bombarded with messages.....it can't be down. Greg -----Original Message----- Sent: Sunday, July 25, 1999 7:41 AM Subject: Re: list Steve,I haven't sent a test message or anything, but I've receivednothing in 24 hours. Bet it's down. I sent a message yesterday afternoonthat hasn't appeared on my computer yet.Harry Steve Trauthwein wrote: Harry, I just sent a test message to the list and got a fatal error message from my server. Is the list down, or do I need to unsub and sub again?TIA. Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from briansr@point-net.com Mon Jul 26 10:33:28 1999 Subject: Re: Gunsmith Thanks to one and all on this subject.So far on the Barr #5wt.7ft 10 or 12 Gar (all on #2 Bombers!!!! and GREATFUN especially when it comes to releasing the fish) Rod is developing apronounced fishing setCheers Brian from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Jul 26 10:42:50 1999 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au) Subject: Taste of things to come? The town I live in had power strikes last Friday and my SP got SNAFU'duntil just now.Unfortunately any mail I was sent in the mean time is somewhere in thedatasphere so if anybody emailed me and I haven't replied that's what'shappened. Tony /***********************************************************************/ Q. How many Microsoft personel does it take to change a light bulb? A. None. They change the new standard to "Darkness" Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.html /***********************************************************************/ from briansr@point-net.com Mon Jul 26 10:52:11 1999 Subject: Re:test TEST?????!!!!!! TEST????????????To all the LIST-PROFESSORS the test was THIS weekend, I forgot to study(again!!!!!)Cheers Brian from tdapple@execpc.com Mon Jul 26 10:53:10 1999 0500 bypop04.execpc.com (8.8.8) id JAA20690 for; Sun, 25 Jul 199909:21:29 - 0500 Subject: unsubscribe boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0071_01BED67F.A0BBB780" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0071_01BED67F.A0BBB780 Please remove me from the list. Tim Apple"Bamboo is Better" ------=_NextPart_000_0071_01BED67F.A0BBB780 Please remove me from the list. Tim Apple"Bamboo is Better" ------=_NextPart_000_0071_01BED67F.A0BBB780-- from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Mon Jul 26 11:05:54 1999 Tue, 27 Jul 1999 00:06:30 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au) Subject: Re:test I have a son like that ;-) Tony On Mon, 26 Jul 1999, Brian Sturrock wrote: TEST?????!!!!!! TEST????????????To all the LIST-PROFESSORS the test was THIS weekend, I forgot tostudy(again!!!!!)Cheers Brian /***********************************************************************/ Q. How many Microsoft personel does it take to change a light bulb? A. None. They change the new standard to "Darkness" Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.html /***********************************************************************/ from rsgould@cmc.net Mon Jul 26 13:08:11 1999 Subject: CC de France Hi Johan, Here's how I was able to find out the same information you are looking foron a Hardy CC de France rod I own:1. The reel seat of my rod had a serial number and a letter stamped intothe aluminum end cap.2. I wrote to Hardy giving them the rod length, number of sections and theserial number and asked them to tell me when it was built and for whatlinesize. Their address is:House of Hardy Ltd.Willowburn, AlnickNorthumberland NE66 2PGEngland3. They responded rather promptly telling me rod rod was made in 1939andwas built for a 5wt. I hope they can do the same for you regarding yourrod.I suspect they have an email address now but I don't know what it is.Ray Gould from lathebaby@yahoo.com Mon Jul 26 15:53:34 1999 1999 16:53:31 EDT Subject: Re: Books for the Beginner Jay, You have probably gotten several replies by now, but there are surelysome lurkers out there wanting to know the answers to the samequestion. Now is a good time to remind everyone that the 'Reply All'button is the one to hit most of the time. We all like to be in on thediscussions and the ANSWERS to questions like this one. I heartily recommend Wayne Cattanach's book (although he is supposed tocome out with a new edition very soon). Wayne has excellentinstructions for tools such as forms, binders, diptanks, and ovens. Howell's book is also very good, but refers to Wayne's book in a fewplaces so you might want to consider that. Howell's main advantage ismore photos. Picturesare worth a thousand words. Maurer and Elser's book is also very user friendly and has good photos.The Maurer/Elser book and the Howell book are similar in quality, butMaurer and Elser do break down the process into easily followed steps. Ray Gould has a book out as well, but I haven't seen it so I can'treally comment or recommend it for beginners. My guess is that you will eventually own them all - and why not. Theyeach have some slight differences in techniques and recommendations peradhesives, finish, etc. Also, they each contain different rod tapers. Finally, you will eventually want to own Garrison's book. He has thebest explanations of WHY rodmakers do things certain ways. Many of themore experienced rodmakers on this list had little else but Mr.Garrison's book to guide them. Some explanations are considered a bitfaulty, but the concepts are sound and others have built heavily on histheories and practices. For the beginner though, he can be a bitoverwhelming. Much easier to digest after reading one of the above. Have fun, take your time reading and investigating, then just DO IT! BTW, do it the cheap way first and go from there. You can spend alifetime waiting to collect all the tools. My recommendation is to notgo that route. Rick C.--- Fdcm@aol.com wrote:All I have decided to make the plunge and attempt tobuild my first bamboo fly rod. The first challenge that I am facing isdeciding which of the many books on the market are in fact worth purchasing. I'm not having much luck with finding any to thumb through so I am sure Iwill have to order them. You comments would be greatly appreciated. ThanksJay _________________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com from jackdale@uswest.net Mon Jul 26 16:11:31 1999 (206.196.156.235) Subject: Re: Books for the Beginner 4A894E4698DE804211C70AE7" --------------4A894E4698DE804211C70AE7 Jay,Another research resource you will find valuable is athttp://www.artistree.com/SplitCaneLibrary/ There you will find theanswers, in one form or another, to many of your initial questions.Cordially,Jack Dale Rick Crenshaw wrote: Jay, You have probably gotten several replies by now, but there are surelysome lurkers out there wanting to know the answers to the samequestion. Now is a good time to remind everyone that the 'Reply All'button is the one to hit most of the time. We all like to be in on thediscussions and the ANSWERS to questions like this one. I heartily recommend Wayne Cattanach's book (although he is supposed tocome out with a new edition very soon). Wayne has excellentinstructions for tools such as forms, binders, diptanks, and ovens. Howell's book is also very good, but refers to Wayne's book in a fewplaces so you might want to consider that. Howell's main advantage ismore photos. Picturesare worth a thousand words. Maurer and Elser's book is also very user friendly and has good photos.The Maurer/Elser book and the Howell book are similar in quality, butMaurer and Elser do break down the process into easily followed steps. Ray Gould has a book out as well, but I haven't seen it so I can'treally comment or recommend it for beginners. My guess is that you will eventually own them all - and why not. Theyeach have some slight differences in techniques and recommendationsperadhesives, finish, etc. Also, they each contain different rod tapers. Finally, you will eventually want to own Garrison's book. He has thebest explanations of WHY rodmakers do things certain ways. Many of themore experienced rodmakers on this list had little else but Mr.Garrison's book to guide them. Some explanations are considered a bitfaulty, but the concepts are sound and others have built heavily on histheories and practices. For the beginner though, he can be a bitoverwhelming. Much easier to digest after reading one of the above. Have fun, take your time reading and investigating, then just DO IT!BTW, do it the cheap way first and go from there. You can spend alifetime waiting to collect all the tools. My recommendation is to notgo that route. Rick C.--- Fdcm@aol.com wrote:All I have decided to make the plunge and attempt tobuild my first bamboo flyrod. The first challenge that I am facing isdeciding which of the manybooks on the market are in fact worth purchasing.I'm not having much luckwith finding any to thumb through so I am sure Iwill have to order them. You comments would be greatly appreciated. ThanksJay _________________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com --------------4A894E4698DE804211C70AE7 Jay,Another research resource you will find valuable is at There you will find the answers, in one form or another, to many of yourinitial questions.Cordially,Jack Dale Rick Crenshaw wrote:Jay, You have probably gotten several replies by now, but there are surelysome lurkers out there wanting to know the answers to the same All' in on thediscussions and the ANSWERS to questions like this one. I heartily recommend Wayne Cattanach's book (although he is supposedto instructions for tools such as forms, binders, diptanks, and ovens. Howell's book is also very good, but refers to Wayne's book in a few advantageismore photos. Picturesare worth a thousand words. Maurer and Elser's book is also very user friendly and has good photos. quality,butMaurer and Elser do break down the process into easily followedsteps. Ray Gould has a book out as well, but I haven't seen it so I can'treally comment or recommend it for beginners. Theyeach have some slight differences in techniques and recommendationsper tapers. the Manyof themore experienced rodmakers on this list had little else but Mr. considereda bitfaulty, but the concepts are sound and others have built heavily onhis bit above. Have fun, take your time reading and investigating, then just DO IT! a is to notgo that route. Rick C.--- Fdcm@aol.com wrote:All I have decided to make the plunge and attempt tobuild my first bamboo fly deciding which of the manybooks on the market are in fact worth purchasing.I'm not having much luckwith finding any to thumb through so I am sure Iwill have to order them. You comments would be greatly appreciated. ThanksJay _________________________________________________________Do You Yahoo!?Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com --------------4A894E4698DE804211C70AE7-- from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Mon Jul 26 16:12:39 1999 0400 Subject: RE: dip tank motors Harry, All you need is a drying motor from Cabelas...I think mine was $20 or sowith stands (you can go cheaper without and make your own). It's in theirTackle Craft catalog (call them). It is a very slow motor (I think 4 rpm). Ihave it mounted on a short 2X6 piece of wood (the stand is actuallymountedto the 2x6 piece) and I have a thin dowel taped to the part that turns. Theother end of the dowel goes through a hole in another piece of wood so itcan turn freely. I then have a string (fishing line...not mono) tied to thedowel. The string runs to a hook on the ceiling of my room, and then backdown to the rod in the pvc tube I use for a dip tank. As the motor turns itwinds up the string and extracts the rod. I can vary speed of extraction bychanging the diameter of the dowel. A more expensive multispeed motorwithon/off switch would be even better (you have to unplug mine to stop it). Bythe way, I used a twisty-tie taped to the rod in an upside down U shape sothat it hung straight. This is crude, and not for doing many rods at once, but it worked for myfirst rod. The finish came out flawless...no sags, drips, runs. The entireassembly with pvc tube and end caps was probably no more than $35. Let me know if you need a better explanation...Andy -----Original Message----- Subject: dip tank motors I sent this over the weekend, and either I've beenbumped off the list, or we've had server troubles. Ifthis is a repeat, sorry for the waste of bandwidth.Since I've been out of pocket, I missed any replies. Friends,The old rotisserie motor I've used on my diptank for the last three years is on its very last leg.Guess it's time to buy one of the fancy-dancy steppermotors from H&R that I've seen in some of your booksand referred to on Jerry's page as: -----Stepper motors for DIP TANKS TM93KIT2421 (kit) -----or TM93KIT2421/A (assembled unit) They alsohave power supplies. Here's my question: I am, shall we say,electronically challenged. What all do I need to buy(power supply?). Like I say, I'm ignorant, so I needspecifics, including part #'s, if you don't mind. I'malso not rich, so let's don't have any suggestions over $100 US. Thanks,Harry PS, how much re-wiring am I going to have to do? from jcbyrd@direct-pest.com Mon Jul 26 19:25:21 1999 with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.83.R) "Morgan Hand Mill Mailing List" ,"Bob King" ,"Bamboo Flyrod List" Subject: Fw: A n(ode) in cane. Or "The millers tale" Hey folks, please forgive the length of this post, but I thought that thoseof you who don't read Rec.outdoors.fishing.fly would find this humorous. Itis a poem penned by Mike Conner as a parody of all that has transpiredwithGeorge Gherke and his rodbuilding project. I do have to admire George for his tenacity. Joe ----- Original Message ----- Newsgroups: rec.outdoors.fishing.fly Subject: A n(ode) in cane. Or "The millers tale" Good morning all you roffians, God bless your hearts and souls,I recently decided to build some fishing poles,now most just laughed when told of this and thought I never could,so just to prove the buggers wrong I made some out of wood. Good morning all you roffians, the first one made was strong,but when one cast the blank just broke, perhaps the wood was wrong ?a lot more wood was ordered then, the very best bamboo,the first few rods though fell apart, perhaps it was the glue ? Good morning all you roffians, at last a rod was made,which very nearly almost just got past tomato holding grade,the butts were perfect, well OK, and showed all the quality signs,apart from a couple of teeny weeny ever so small glue lines Good morning all you roffians, at last I can explain,why glue lines are important on a good rod made of cane,when you see the glue this means its good and this just goes to showwhat all the other makers just do not seem to know Good morning all you roffians, the cane at last is split,but when I tried to taper it, I landed in the shit.so I had to build a mill as well for tapering you see,the price shot up a bit of course, but to this you must agree. Good morning all you roffians, thanks for letters of intent,I cant deliver just quite yet, the first batch all got bent,I straightened some by using heat, and a couple got quite burned,so some will get black fly rods now, I hope you're not concerned ? Good morning all you roffians, I really love this place,ten thousand ways and means there are, to save a bit of face,I invented just a brand new way a good cane rod to wrap,but when it was at last turned out, it was a load of crap. Good morning all you roffians, thanks for your assistance,on second thoughts go F... yourselves, all I need's persistencewhen the rod is finished you will see, its worth ten times the money,and I will make a fortune too, and you wont think that's so funny. Good morning all you roffians, let us now allay your fears,my rod is just far better than those of former years,It will have a grip of finest cork, and of course a brand new butt,just admiring the varnished beauty will bust most folks a gut Good morning all you roffians, at last we have some tipsit cost me sweat and blood and tears, to mill the perfect strips,the mill broke down, the beer ran out, and worse the famous grouse,but my dream is there for you to share, such a rod in every house. Good morning all you roffians, what are all these useless hollers,this is the rod that I built, and I am doing it for dollars.just to prove without a doubt that you were all quite wrong,and I had the satisfaction of knowing all along. Good morning all you roffians, I know have learned to whittle,the black rods have been thrown away, they were a little brittle,back to blonde then is the way for a clever man to gowhen will they be ready ? Oh we will let you know. Good morning all you roffians, at last we're in production,and I'm sure you'll all agree on the beautiful constructionDickerson ? Leonard ? what did they know, they didn't have a chancemy rod is simply better, one can see that at a glance Good morning all you roffians, now let us view the facts,the rod is more expensive now, because of purchase taxbut it will still be cheaper, than almost any other,and you'll only have to handle one to love it like your mother. Good morning all you roffians, even those who are pissed off,the first rod now is finished, and will be sold on roff,not quite as cheaply as the rest, but I'm sure you will agree,it must be worth the money, after all it's made by me. Good morning all you roffians, even those who scorned and laughedI am a genius you see and not as some think daft,You had the chance, I told you so, I gave you lots of prods,to buy at last this wondrous thing, one of my home made rods. Good morning all you roffians, we have cast the first cane dream,we took it out this morning, and tried it on the stream,it really is fantastic, it really is a blast,I hope that all hard feelings are now well and truly past. Good morning all you roffians, we are now delivering,I know your little junk yard hearts with delight are simply quivering, It's not too bad, and just the story of its birth should make you happy. Good morning all you roffians, we now have some better versions,and woe to those of you who think, you may lightly cast aspersions,My rod will live on when yours is dead, and that is only fair,at least I moved my arse and made one, I bet you wouldn't dare. Good morning all you roffians, even though the rod may stink,It is good and cheap, and that's the point, you can get one free with ginkthe gink of course has had to be increased drastically in price,but after all it is the best, and just knowing that is nice Good morning all you roffians, at last I have the feel,so I am going to start again, but this time with a reel,with hourly updates every day we will try and keep you posted,I may not manage it myself, so I will have some "ghosted" Good morning all you roffians.................................... Just taking the piss a bit George, must have been the last glass ofwhiskey. Tight lines ! Mike Connor from richjez@enteract.com Mon Jul 26 21:09:35 1999 0000 Subject: Re: Test I looks like there is a developing need for a 12 step program for slow daysonthe list.Rich Jezioro *________________________________)// Rich Jezioro @ /||/______/_||_________________________________________|| /\ / \ > > from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Mon Jul 26 23:30:23 1999 Subject: forms Hi Guys,Can anyone tell me anything about forms from Colorado Bootstrap I'm thinking of ordering a set from them. Are they a good source? are they worth the money, and so on.... from jpsnbs@erols.com Mon Jul 26 23:44:29 1999 Subject: Re: forms I made my original forms and still use them today. However, I purchased aset from Mr. Moon, Colorado Bootstrap, earlier this year and believe theyare very nice for the money. They are functional and certainly as accurateas the ones I made 9 years ago. I don't believe you will find a betterdeal. Just my humble opinion and certainly with no comercial interestintended.Joe Swam-----Original Message----- Subject: forms Hi Guys,Can anyone tell me anything about forms from Colorado BootstrapI'm thinking of ordering a set from them. Are they a good source? are theyworth the money, and so on.... from saltwein@swbell.net Tue Jul 27 06:44:32 1999 Subject: BFRM I hear the magazine has folded. Is it true? Regards, SteveIndependence, MO from stuart.tod@virgin.net Tue Jul 27 09:32:10 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.02 201-229-111-106) with SMTP +0100 Subject: Geirach Tapers boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001A_01BED845.87615AC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BED845.87615AC0 Does anyone know where I can lay my hands on the following tapers? 'Best Signature' 7'-6" 2-pc 4wt 'Signature' 7'-9" 2-pc 5wt 'Best Special' 8'-6" 5wt & 6wt (Possibly by Michael D Clark of South Creek Ltd?)All replies appreciated!Stuart ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BED845.87615AC0 Does anyone know where I can lay my = following tapers? 4wt 'Signature' 7'-9" 2-pc5wt 'Best Special' 8'-6" 5wt & =6wt (Possibly by Michael D Clark of South = Ltd?)All replies appreciated!Stuart ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01BED845.87615AC0-- from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Tue Jul 27 10:54:31 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) 0500 Subject: Re: dip tank motors Thanks go out to all who so generously offered their help, both on andoff list. I think I can figure out how to make the thing raise and lower therod at the right speed, if I can just get it wired where it doesn't shock mewhen I touch it, or burn down the house when I plug it in.Harry andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com wrote: Harry, All you need is a drying motor from Cabelas.>snipped from Craig.Naldrett@ibm.net Tue Jul 27 14:46:10 1999 (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA82210 for; Tue, 27 Jul 199919:46:06 GMT Subject: Glue Info? While looking for re-supply of Resorcinol, local shop suggested thefollowing as an alternative, anybody used it, comments?Following from MSDS faxed to local supplier AM18 Marine Glue (Plastic Resin)(Urea Formaldehyde Resin)Manufactured by Dural-Division Of Multibond Inc. (in Canada, don't knowabout US)Mix 10 parts powder to 6 parts water (by weight)Pot Life: 3 hrsAssembly Time: Maximum 30 minutesPressing Time: 6 hrs.Color: Dries shade of BrownShelf Life: 1 year at room temperatureShear Strength: 400 lbs/sq. in.Thanks for any input on "this" glue.CheersCraig from jczimny@dol.net Tue Jul 27 15:16:38 1999 Subject: Re: Glue Info? Craig ,Would it be possible for you to get an address or phone number for thiscompany for us?As a comment, it is most probably plain-old (albeit very good) UF Resin.Urea Formaldehydes are the first resin ever synthesized in the laboratory-circa 1830 in Germany. Actually, one can cook up a batch in your ownbasement. I've tried this and it works fine. However, the resin ,withoutthe addition of buffers, begins to cure immediately upon synthesis.John Z from ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil Tue Jul 27 17:35:32 1999 1.redstone.army.mil Subject: RE: Wayne Cattanach Tapers Thanks for the input. Am I correct in assuming that the parabolic willhavea "feel" unlike any of my "normal" cane rods. In the Archives there was acomment that the 8'6" Granger 4wt was "parabolic". I've got one yet itdoesn't feel different from my Hardy or Edwards. Ralph -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: Wayne Cattanach Tapers Being an engineer (no hissing please.....) how should I go aboutdetermining just what I've got when it gets here? What should Ilook/feel Take it out on the lawn and cast it for a little while. Once you feelyou'vegot the timing down, put it down and cast something else for a littlewhile.Then go back to the new rod. How's it "feel?" If you like it, you gotagoodrod. If you don't like it, you wasted your money. How do I cast a parabolic differently from a "normal" rod? You'll find that you use more wrist and wait for the rod to do the work.Atleast that's what I've been told. Unfortunately, there's no real formula for what makes a rod right of any ofus.fortunately, there are a lot of tapers and a lot of builders.... Terry "Sunfish" KirkpatrickSafety Harbor, Fl.(Old Tampa Bay)sats@gte.net from Craig.Naldrett@ibm.net Tue Jul 27 18:00:16 1999 out1.ibm.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA73468; Tue, 27 Jul 199923:00:11 GMT Subject: Re: Glue Info? Thanks for responses, Info for Dural is:550 Marshall Ave.Doral, QC (Quebec Canada)H9P 1C9Phone 514 636-6230Did a quick search for them to find a website, no luck but did find atrailer park in Sydney, Australia.Question for John Z, as I am a glue illiterate what "buffers" could beused to inhibit curing? & is 400 PSI shear strength a problem? I thinkI'll buy some AM18 just to test it "as is" myself, any recommendedmethods other than gluing up a rod & stress testing over time.Re: Resorcinol, thanks for options guys, I found a stash today of theWeldwood I have used, so am good for awhile. The whole point of theexercise was to find a source in Canada & stay away from shipping.I havebeen happy (so far no failures) with the glue I use, just curious aboutthis AM18 UF as I can get it locally.CheersCraig from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Tue Jul 27 19:47:20 1999 Wed, 28 Jul 1999 08:48:33 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au) Subject: Re: Glue Info? Craig,that works fine. Just make sure you use it in a well ventilated space.It does tack a bit faster than resorcinol. Tony On Tue, 27 Jul 1999, Craig Naldrett wrote: While looking for re-supply of Resorcinol, local shop suggested thefollowing as an alternative, anybody used it, comments?Following from MSDS faxed to local supplier AM18 Marine Glue (Plastic Resin)(Urea Formaldehyde Resin)Manufactured by Dural-Division Of Multibond Inc. (in Canada, don't knowabout US)Mix 10 parts powder to 6 parts water (by weight)Pot Life: 3 hrsAssembly Time: Maximum 30 minutesPressing Time: 6 hrs.Color: Dries shade of BrownShelf Life: 1 year at room temperatureShear Strength: 400 lbs/sq. in.Thanks for any input on "this" glue.CheersCraig /***********************************************************************/ Q. How many Microsoft personel does it take to change a light bulb? A. None. They change the new standard to "Darkness" Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.html /***********************************************************************/ from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au Tue Jul 27 19:59:44 1999 Wed, 28 Jul 1999 09:00:49 +0800 (WST)(envelope- from tyoung@perth.dialix.com.au) Subject: Re: Glue Info? JZ would be able to comment here but I'd say any UF would work well. I gota hold of some all liquid UF made by Borden and it worked great. I alsotried Cascomite once. It's a by product of milk and used to be called coldwater glue presumably because all the other glues around at the time hadto be heated and all you do with this stuff is add water and mix it to apancake mix consistancy.Anyhow I looked into it a bit and found this is also a UF glue. Worksgreat for laminating except for greasy woods like teak. The only hasle with Cascomite powder is there dosn't seem to be any wayofinhibiting it's pot life. I did make a glued lapstrake dingy from from it3 years ago though and it's still going strong which is saying somethingbecause my dingys get treated with extreme prejudice. Tony On Tue, 27 Jul 1999, Craig Naldrett wrote: Thanks for responses, Info for Dural is:550 Marshall Ave.Doral, QC (Quebec Canada)H9P 1C9Phone 514 636-6230Did a quick search for them to find a website, no luck but did find atrailer park in Sydney, Australia.Question for John Z, as I am a glue illiterate what "buffers" could beused to inhibit curing? & is 400 PSI shear strength a problem? I thinkI'll buy some AM18 just to test it "as is" myself, any recommendedmethods other than gluing up a rod & stress testing over time.Re: Resorcinol, thanks for options guys, I found a stash today of theWeldwood I have used, so am good for awhile. The whole point of theexercise was to find a source in Canada & stay away from shipping.I havebeen happy (so far no failures) with the glue I use, just curious aboutthis AM18 UF as I can get it locally.CheersCraig /***********************************************************************/ Q. How many Microsoft personel does it take to change a light bulb? A. None. They change the new standard to "Darkness" Tony Younghttp://www.iinet.net.au/~mainpeak/flyrod.html /***********************************************************************/ from rvenneri@ulster.net Tue Jul 27 20:15:18 1999 Subject: logan lathes Hey guys any one know where to get logan lathe parts. Picked one upcheap and I want to spruce it up a bit. Best regardsBob VVenneri's21 Chuck Hill Rdsaugerties NY 12477914 246 5882rvenneri@ulster.net from jjohnso4@bellsouth.net Tue Jul 27 20:30:33 1999 Subject: Re: logan lathes At 09:15 PM 7/27/99 -0400, Robert Venneri wrote: Hey guys any one know where to get logan lathe parts. Picked one upcheap and I want to spruce it up a bit. Hi Robert, You might try going straight to the horse's mouth - Logan Actuator [773] 736-7500 Later,Johnny ----------------------------------------------Johnny JohnsonLilburn, GA from jczimny@dol.net Tue Jul 27 20:56:02 1999 Subject: Re: Glue Info? Actually, water, which is added acts as a buffer. But, it could be anythingthat keeps the mixture on the alkaline side.John Z Craig Naldrett wrote: Thanks for responses, Info for Dural is:550 Marshall Ave.Doral, QC (Quebec Canada)H9P 1C9Phone 514 636-6230Did a quick search for them to find a website, no luck but did find atrailer park in Sydney, Australia.Question for John Z, as I am a glue illiterate what "buffers" could beused to inhibit curing? & is 400 PSI shear strength a problem? I thinkI'll buy some AM18 just to test it "as is" myself, any recommendedmethods other than gluing up a rod & stress testing over time.Re: Resorcinol, thanks for options guys, I found a stash today of theWeldwood I have used, so am good for awhile. The whole point of theexercise was to find a source in Canada & stay away from shipping.I havebeen happy (so far no failures) with the glue I use, just curious aboutthis AM18 UF as I can get it locally.CheersCraig from Craig.Naldrett@ibm.net Tue Jul 27 20:59:37 1999 out1.ibm.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA26470; Wed, 28 Jul 199901:59:31 GMT Subject: Re: Glue Info? Well I guess I'll give the AM18 a lash, will let the list know whathappens.CheersCraig from dpeaston@wzrd.com Tue Jul 27 22:41:46 1999 Subject: RE: Wayne Cattanach Tapers At 05:34 PM 7/27/1999 -0500, Shuey, Ralph wrote:Thanks for the input. Am I correct in assuming that the parabolic willhavea "feel" unlike any of my "normal" cane rods. In the Archives there was acomment that the 8'6" Granger 4wt was "parabolic". I've got one yet itdoesn't feel different from my Hardy or Edwards. Ralph -----Original Message----- Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 1999 5:05 PM Subject: Re: Wayne Cattanach Tapers Ralph,Like the man said, "fortunateley there are lots of different tapers." Thereare even many different interpretations of the "parabolic" taper. Generallythey are defined as having a moderate tip a strong mid and a weaker butt.The stres curve is therfore rather like a parabola. If you look through thestress curves in either Jerry's or Stetzer's archives you will see manyvariations on that curve. I have some experience with the Granger actionhaving an 8'6" aristocrat. The stress curve is in Jerrys's rodmakers' page.This rod does not behave much differently than other rods if it is forcedwith fast short "graphite pushing strokes" but when you slooow down andelongate your wrist snap with about 35 ft of line out the damn thingwantsto shoot another 25 ft. (hype? ). It feels just loveley to me and makesa loop in a triangle taper line that is just about all you could ask for. -Doug Easton from rCoring@Industra.com Tue Jul 27 23:25:09 1999 be forged)) Tue, 27 Jul 1999 21:27:54 -0800 Subject: Need advice I have a 12 ft English 3 piece split cane rod (for float fishing not fly)called "The Shoreham" made by A1 of London in good condition but with aloose ferrule without binding. I would like to know if it is worth more in"as is" condition or whether I should refinish it. If refinish, can anybodytell me how. Do I chemically strip it or sand it? Alternatively, is anyoneinterested in buying it. from OBorge@aiss.uic.edu Wed Jul 28 08:58:58 1999 Wed, 28 Jul 1999 07:32:34 -0500 rvenneri@ulster.net,rodmakers@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: logan lathes Logan has a web site: http://www.loganact.com/index.html Olaf BorgeUniversity of IllinoisAITS/SSS312/996-5212 -----Original Message----- Subject: Re: logan lathes At 09:15 PM 7/27/99 -0400, Robert Venneri wrote: Hey guys any one know where to get logan lathe parts. Picked one upcheap and I want to spruce it up a bit. Hi Robert, You might try going straight to the horse's mouth - Logan Actuator [773] 736-7500 Later,Johnny ----------------------------------------------Johnny JohnsonLilburn, GA from anglport@con2.com Wed Jul 28 10:26:23 1999 Subject: Finishing Hello from the right coast... where you can bake your cane by leavingitout in the front yard for the 8 to 9 minutes (if you don't mind thehumidity).I have a question on finishing the wraps separately from the shaft. Ireally like the look of the shaft being satin and the wraps glossy (and youdon't have to worry about runs after every wrap exits the dip-tank) but I'mhaving real trouble getting the wrap edges crisp when I do them.My sequence is to dip 4 times and rub out with rottenstone, then addwrapsand varnish them.I'm using an artist's brush a little narrower than the wrap and Man o'War. Have tried both thinned and straight. The thinned runs onto the blankmore easily and the thick seems to want to sag (I'm turning at about 18rpm). I don't want to starve the edges of the wrap and risk its earlywearing but it looks a bit scuzzy if the edges aren't right on the wrap orparallel to and right next to the it.I know masking tape will leave an edge (at least in all MY paintingexperience -- so if you think not, I'd like to know what I always did wrongTHERE!)and I may have heard of a paint-it-on or spray-it-on mask forwindows but I think that had to be scraped off, which should negate IT'susefulness.Any suggestions?Thanks,Art from jf_gray@ix.netcom.com Wed Jul 28 13:22:13 1999 13:21:34 -0500 ix7.ix.netcom.com viasmap (V1.3) Subject: Broken tap @#%$^&! Help! I did the stupidist thing in the world. Yes, I broke off a tap threadingthe second to last hole on my forms. I am so dumb!!!! What can I do? Icalled a machine shop that's an hour drive and they want $45 to removeit. Is there a way to do it myself? Has anyone else ever done such an my measurements from the old spot? Of course then it will always be areminder. Help! from TSmithwick@aol.com Wed Jul 28 14:26:42 1999 Subject: Re: Broken tap @#%$^&! Help! rodmakers@wugate.wustl.edu In a message dated 7/28/99 6:28:22 PM, you wrote: You have a lot of company. Your chief alternatives are as follows: 1) Finesse. Get a high quality tap extractor from an industrial supplyhouse, not the hardware store. These things have prongs that slide in next to the tap and allow you to try to turn it. Flood the hole with WD-40, turn the extractor and pray that it doesn't break. 2) Violence. After the tap extractor breaks, turn the bar over, insert a punch in the hole, bash it with a hammer, and try to drive the tap out. 3) Poverty. When all this fails, take the bar to someone with a wire EDM machine and have them cut the little SOB out. 4) Resignation. Accept the fact that your form will have a broken tap as a permanent feature, drill a hole as close as possible, and live with the results. The world won't come to an end. Once more for the benefit of newbies, never try to make a set of formswith a hardware store tap. They will break every time no matter how careful youare. Go to an industrial supply house and get a quality tap, they are worth the slight difference in price and the extra aggravation in obtaining them. from Eastkoyfly@aol.com Wed Jul 28 14:26:48 1999 Subject: Re: Finishing Art,I just use my thumb along the edge of the wrap to clean up any run off, you can also use a piece of silk to soak up excess. from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Jul 28 15:21:34 1999 Subject: Re: Glue Info? If that is the Marine Glue in a green, white and blue can with a boat onthe label ? I have tried it and found it to be weak and not very heatresistant compared to other products.I could have got an old batch that had been on the shelf for years soyou may have better luck.Terry Craig Naldrett wrote: Well I guess I'll give the AM18 a lash, will let the list know whathappens.CheersCraig from hexagon@odyssee.net Wed Jul 28 15:55:37 1999 Subject: wasting time I have just received my account from my internet provider and last monthI spent a total of 57 hours on line! What a complete waste of time and asummer.I was building lots of rods before I got addicted to surfing about 2 1/2years ago and now I hardly enter my workshop.Is there any other rodmakers with the same problem? from Craig.Naldrett@ibm.net Wed Jul 28 16:31:10 1999 out5.ibm.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA99080; Wed, 28 Jul 199921:30:35 GMT Subject: Re: Glue Info? Not sure what the can looks like, local distrubuter only has it in 11 kgcans (they do have 500 ml cans in Quebec apparantly), a little more thanI want for experiments.! Have arranged through him to get a few ozs. fortesting, will do heat, soaking, shear/bending tests, all unscientificbut about all I can think of. Will let the List know what I find out,may be a month or so, local rivers just coming right.CheersCraig from jf_gray@ix.netcom.com Wed Jul 28 16:41:32 1999 16:40:51 -0500 ix6.ix.netcom.com viasmap (V1.3) Subject: Broken Tap - Thanks Thanks to all for the broken tap suggestions. I went to an industrialsupply shop and bought a tap extractor. It summarily shattered afterdousing everything with WD40, cutting oil and prayers, and very gently(well not too gently) turning it :>( I then took another piece of advice and got out a center puch and a VBH(very big hammer) and threw caution to wind and knocked the snot out ofit. Hurray!! :>) It shattered out the other end nicely and I managedto re-thread the hole. I am going to hang the shattered tap above mybench as a reminder that patience is the key element in this art ofbamboo! Thanks to all. from rp43640@online-club.de Wed Jul 28 18:08:12 1999 Thu, 29 Jul 1999 01:07:58 +0200 (METDST) RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: Re: Finishing just use a needle instead of a brush but be careful on the edges. If you want to use a tape try some of 3M's tapes used for automotivepainting Christian Hello from the right coast... where you can bake your cane by leavingitout in the front yard for the 8 to 9 minutes (if you don't mind thehumidity).I have a question on finishing the wraps separately from the shaft. Ireally like the look of the shaft being satin and the wraps glossy (andyoudon't have to worry about runs after every wrap exits the dip- tank) butI'mhaving real trouble getting the wrap edges crisp when I do them.My sequence is to dip 4 times and rub out with rottenstone, thenadd wrapsand varnish them.I'm using an artist's brush a little narrower than the wrap and Mano'War. Have tried both thinned and straight. The thinned runs onto the blankmore easily and the thick seems to want to sag (I'm turning at about 18rpm). I don't want to starve the edges of the wrap and risk its earlywearing but it looks a bit scuzzy if the edges aren't right on the wrap orparallel to and right next to the it.I know masking tape will leave an edge (at least in all MY paintingexperience -- so if you think not, I'd like to know what I always didwrongTHERE!)and I may have heard of a paint-it-on or spray- it-on mask forwindows but I think that had to be scraped off, which should negate IT'susefulness.Any suggestions?Thanks,Art from channer@hubwest.com Wed Jul 28 18:21:00 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A0BE12E0120; Wed, 28 Jul 1999 17:22:38 MST Subject: Re: wasting time At 04:58 PM 7/28/99 -0400, TERENCE ACKLAND wrote:I have just received my account from my internet provider and last monthI spent a total of 57 hours on line! What a complete waste of time and asummer.I was building lots of rods before I got addicted to surfing about 2 1/2years ago and now I hardly enter my workshop.Is there any other rodmakers with the same problem? Terry;I am not sure it's a total waste of time, it is more entertaining thansitcoms and no doubt not as brain-damaging, but it sure does cut into therodmaking time. Fortunatly for me, my wife hogs the computer most of thetime and I can't stand most of what is on the tube, so i still manage tospend a fair amount of time in the shop.John from channer@hubwest.com Wed Jul 28 18:25:11 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id A1B41390120; Wed, 28 Jul 1999 17:26:44 MST Subject: Re: Broken tap @#%$^&! Help! At 11:21 AM 7/28/99 -0700, Jeremy Gray wrote:I did the stupidist thing in the world. Yes, I broke off a tap threadingthe second to last hole on my forms. I am so dumb!!!! What can I do? Icalled a machine shop that's an hour drive and they want $45 to removeit. Is there a way to do it myself? Has anyone else ever done such an my measurements from the old spot? Of course then it will always be areminder. Help! Jeremy;I did the same thing, once upon a time. Go to the hardware store and get apin punch that fits the original hole and drive the tap out backwards.Youwill probably have to drill the hole out the next size larger and use abigger bolt. If this doesn't work, then you are on your own, it's the onlysolution I have come up with. Forget drilling the tap out, they arehardened steel and the drill bit will just move over along side of it. GoodluckJohn from HomeyDKlown@worldnet.att.net Wed Jul 28 18:45:53 1999 with ESMTP id ;Wed, 28 Jul 1999 23:45:19 +0000 Subject: Re: Finishing Art, I was going to suggest a tack rag. It seemed to work pretty well on mySouth Bend. Just have to be careful when you get close to the wraps. Having a desk mounted, lighted magnifying glass helps too. Dennis Eastkoyfly@aol.com wrote: Art,I just use my thumb along the edge of the wrap to clean up any runoff,you can also use a piece of silk to soak up excess. from Turbotrk@aol.com Wed Jul 28 19:19:28 1999 Subject: glue Hey guys, I have a question. Does anyone know what the glue type is forthe " Super Glue Epoxy Adhesive Super Strength Extra Working Time"? Itclaims a 30 minute working time with a handling time of 7 hours and a cure time of24 hours. The temperature use range is -*85 to +225. Kinda sounds andlooks like Shell Epon but not exactly. Has anyone used it? I saw it in Home Depot and the cost was $2.25. Looked like plenty for one rod. Maybe we can make this thing one step simpler. What do ya'll think? Stuart Miller from rvenneri@ulster.net Wed Jul 28 19:56:22 1999 Subject: Thanks for logan lathe info Thanks again guys. You guys know everything. Hey how many pimples on agolf ball? Just kiddin. But some day Ill stump you guys. Best RegardsBob V from HARMS1@prodigy.net Wed Jul 28 20:29:12 1999 Wed, 28 Jul 1999 21:29:05 -0400 Subject: Re: Finishing boundary="----=_NextPart_000_005D_01BED940.00DEFA60" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_005D_01BED940.00DEFA60 Hi Art, I don't know what kind of a "look" you are after in a finished rod, but =I like to see a finish that blends nicely into the wraps. For this, I =brush about eight coats of varnish on the wraps first, and then I finish =the entire rod. After the first five coats (or so) on the wraps, I let =the varnish cure for a few days and then wet-sand the wraps gently with =1200 grit with wet/dry paper--dipping the little paper squares into =mineral spirits as the lubricant. Then, a couple more coats of varnish, =and lightly sand again. Lastly, I varnish two coats onto the entire =rod. I have always brushed my rods, but the final results would be = between cane and wrap-edge forms a perfect little "ramped" transition. cheers, Bill -----Original Message-----From: Art Port Cc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu Date: Wednesday, July 28, 1999 8:33 AMSubject: Finishing Hello from the right coast... where you can bake your cane by =leaving itout in the front yard for the 8 to 9 minutes (if you don't mind the =humidity).I have a question on finishing the wraps separately from the shaft. =Ireally like the look of the shaft being satin and the wraps glossy =(and youdon't have to worry about runs after every wrap exits the dip-tank) =but I'mhaving real trouble getting the wrap edges crisp when I do them.My sequence is to dip 4 times and rub out with rottenstone, then add =wrapsand varnish them.I'm using an artist's brush a little narrower than the wrap and Man =o'War. Have tried both thinned and straight. The thinned runs onto the =blankmore easily and the thick seems to want to sag (I'm turning at about =18rpm). I don't want to starve the edges of the wrap and risk its =earlywearing but it looks a bit scuzzy if the edges aren't right on the =wrap orparallel to and right next to the it.I know masking tape will leave an edge (at least in all MY paintingexperience -- so if you think not, I'd like to know what I always =did wrongTHERE!)and I may have heard of a paint-it-on or spray-it-on mask forwindows but I think that had to be scraped off, which should negate =IT'susefulness.Any suggestions?Thanks,Art ------=_NextPart_000_005D_01BED940.00DEFA60 Art, I don't know what= "look" you are after in a finished rod, but I like to see a = varnish on the wraps first, and then I = varnish cure for a few days and then wet-sand the wraps gently with 1200= with wet/dry paper--dipping the little paper squares into mineral = always brushed my rods, but the final results would be identical, I'm = = perfect little "ramped" transition. Bill -----Original = =Craig.Naldrett@ibm.net = RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= <RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.edu= FinishingHello from the right coast... = can bake your cane by leaving itout in the front yard for the 8 = minutes (if you don't mind the humidity).I have a question on = the wraps separately from the shaft. Ireally like the look of = being satin and the wraps glossy (and youdon't have to worry = after every wrap exits the dip-tank) but I'mhaving real trouble = the wrap edges crisp when I do them.My sequence is to dip 4 = rub out with rottenstone, then add wrapsand varnish them.I'm = an artist's brush a little narrower than the wrap and Man o'War. = tried both thinned and straight. The thinned runs onto the = easily and the thick seems to want to sag (I'm turning at about = I don't want to starve the edges of the wrap and risk its = orparallel to and right next to the it.I know masking tape = leave an edge (at least in all MY paintingexperience -- so if = not, I'd like to know what I always did wrongTHERE!)and I may = of a paint-it-on or spray-it-on mask forwindows but I think that = suggestions?Thanks,Art ------=_NextPart_000_005D_01BED940.00DEFA60-- from anglport@con2.com Wed Jul 28 21:00:07 1999 Subject: Re: Finishing Bill,I used to do it pretty much your way, except I dipped. Then this timearound I thought I'd try for a satin finish on the rod but a gloss on thewraps. It looks really nice (to my eye at least) but I'm having troublewith the edges of the wraps being "crisp". I can show you what I mean atthe Yellow Breeches, but I can't wait that long to make these two rodsusable *G*. You can grade my attempts when we meet. (I'll show you mineifyou'll show me yours).If the thin autobody tape doesn't do it, I'm gonna be back to aone- sheen-the-whole-rod look. I figure if I dip and rub out the flatsbetween the wraps, I'll risk rubbing the finish off their edges and havethe reverse problem.Thanks,Art At 09:27 PM 7/28/99 -0700, WILLIAM A HARMS wrote:Hi Art, "" For this, I brush about eight coats of varnish on thewraps first, and then "" transition. cheers, Bill -----Original Message-----From: jczimny@dol.netCc: RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduDate: Wednesday, July 28, 1999 8:33 AMSubject: Finishing Hello from the right coast... where you can bake your cane by leaving itout in the front yard for the 8 to 9 minutes (if you don't mind thehumidity).I have a question on finishing the wraps separately from the shaft. Ireally like the look of the shaft being satin and the wraps glossy(and youdon't have to worry about runs after every wrap exits the dip-tank)but I'mhaving real trouble getting the wrap edges crisp when I do them.My sequence is to dip 4 times and rub out with rottenstone, then addwrapsand varnish them.I'm using an artist's brush a little narrower than the wrap and Man o'War. Have tried both thinned and straight. The thinned runs onto theblankmore easily and the thick seems to want to sag (I'm turning at about18rpm). I don't want to starve the edges of the wrap and risk its earlywearing but it looks a bit scuzzy if the edges aren't right on thewrap orparallel to and right next to the it.I know masking tape will leave an edge (at least in all MY paintingexperience -- so if you think not, I'd like to know what I always didwrongTHERE!)and I may have heard of a paint-it-on or spray-it-on mask forwindows but I think that had to be scraped off, which should negateIT'susefulness.Any suggestions?Thanks,Art from miler257@gateway.net Wed Jul 28 21:46:14 1999 Subject: HEXROD boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BED943.0A5DACA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BED943.0A5DACA0 I like using Hexrod on Frank's web page but I would also like the =convenience of working off-line. Can anyone that is currently using one =of the versions of Hexrod on the Rodmakers page which can be downloaded=please comment on its usefulness. I have used the one for excel in the =past but I like the reports in Frank's version better.Thanks, Ed M. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BED943.0A5DACA0 I like using Hexrod on Frank's web page but I would = the convenience of working off-line. Can anyone that is currently using = the versions of Hexrod on the Rodmakers page which can be downloaded = comment on its usefulness. I have used the one for excel in the past but = the reports in Frank's version better.Thanks, Ed =M. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BED943.0A5DACA0-- from DRiver790@aol.com Wed Jul 28 22:42:09 1999 Subject: orangeand black jasper Does anyone know where I can get a small quantity of orange/blackjasper? I only have to rewrap the ferrules on a south bend rod. THANXDave from briansr@point-net.com Wed Jul 28 23:15:26 1999 0000 Subject: Re: Gunsmith Hi List I don't know if this message went out on Sunday ,so I'm a sendin' itagain. Thanks to one and all on this subject.So far on the Barr #5wt.7ft ,10 or 12 Gar (all on #2 Bombers!!!! andGREATFUN ,especially when it comes to releasing the fish) Rod is developing apronounced fishing setCheers Brian from flytyr@southshore.com Thu Jul 29 11:24:58 1999 Subject: Trying to contact Trying to contact Rob Neilsen. Lost his E address. Tony FlyTyr@southshore.com from mschaffer@mindspring.com Thu Jul 29 11:40:40 1999 Subject: Drying time before using a rod. Guys,Although I'm only at the stage of final planing my rod tip pieces (anotherdelightful activity), I was reading George Mauer's book and came upon thestatement that you need to wait 3 months before using a rod afterfinishingwith spar varnish!If you don't mind giving out another 'secret', how long do you wait andwhatare you using for your finish.I also found out that I need to come up with a dip tank, motor and etc.--ohwell, by the time I retire I should have all my goodies made!! (VBG)TIA, Mike Doc (Mike Shaffer)(mschaffer@mindspring.com) from andrew_harsanyi@ibi.com Thu Jul 29 12:23:12 1999 0400 Subject: RE: Finishing Art, if you butt the masking tape right up against the wraps you arevarnishingand then immediately after varnishing remove the masking tape, perhapstherewould be no lines left by the tape. The tape would be there just in case youwnet over the edge of the wraps. You would need a thin, high quality artistbrush and use it as if the you didn't have the masking tape there for amistake.I dipped my blanks and then wrapped and varnished the wraps separately. Ifoundthat if I was really careful I could get it just right, while in other cases Iwould go over. I didn't try this, but the tape, removed right away, mightprevent a bead of varnish from forming at the juncture. You would alsohave tobe very sparing on the varnish, and apply more coats. Just some thoughtsfromsomeone that has only done one rod, so take this for what it's worth....Andy from fbcwin@fsbnet.com Thu Jul 29 13:12:02 1999 (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) Thu, 29 Jul 1999 13:11:43 -0500 Subject: Re: Drying time before using a rod. Doc,I use Pittsurgh Paints 77-5 poly on the rod and the wraps. It wasrecommended by a well known rodmaker. I hard try to wait at least threedaysbefore I try the rod out. But I don't often make it!! I'm kinda like a Dad atthe nursery, handing out cigars and flashing polaroids. Don't take myexperiences as gospel, though. There are lots of folks with moreexperience onthis list. But my first rod has seen a good deal of use, and it shows no illaffects from being tried out soon after its creation.I saw the same thing mentioned in George's book, and it struck me aspuzzling as well. Of course, there is a real possibility that George knowssomething I don't. In fact, I'll bet he knows lots of stuff I don't.....Harry michael w. shaffer wrote: Guys,Although I'm only at the stage of final planing my rod tip pieces (anotherdelightful activity), I was reading George Mauer's book and came upon thestatement that you need to wait 3 months before using a rod afterfinishingwith spar varnish!If you don't mind giving out another 'secret', how long do you wait andwhatare you using for your finish.I also found out that I need to come up with a dip tank, motor and etc.--ohwell, by the time I retire I should have all my goodies made!! (VBG)TIA, Mike Doc (Mike Shaffer)(mschaffer@mindspring.com) from gwbarnes@gwi.net Thu Jul 29 14:32:41 1999 Subject: (no subject) A while back, someone was looking for a copy of "HOW TO MAKE BAMBOOFLYRODS. Donald Taylor, JDBelgrade@aol.com, has an extra copy that he wouldbe willing to sell. If intereted, contact him off line. I have nofinancial interest in the book. George Barnes from hexagon@odyssee.net Thu Jul 29 14:58:24 1999 Subject: Re: wasting time John,I cannot get into the entertaining stuff, my wife and daughter watch melikehawks!I remember when I was on the FF list and there was a thread on " JungleCocks" which took some explaining.In September we are going to purchase a country property with a largebarnwhich I want to turn into a rod shop. I am hoping that a bit of debt will bejust the thing to make me get off my ass.Terry channer wrote: At 04:58 PM 7/28/99 -0400, TERENCE ACKLAND wrote:I have just received my account from my internet provider and lastmonthI spent a total of 57 hours on line! What a complete waste of time and asummer.I was building lots of rods before I got addicted to surfing about 2 1/2years ago and now I hardly enter my workshop.Is there any other rodmakers with the same problem? Terry;I am not sure it's a total waste of time, it is more entertaining thansitcoms and no doubt not as brain-damaging, but it sure does cut into therodmaking time. Fortunatly for me, my wife hogs the computer most ofthetime and I can't stand most of what is on the tube, so i still manage tospend a fair amount of time in the shop.John from dellc@nextdim.com Thu Jul 29 15:43:16 1999 (SMTPD32-4.06) id AA76510242; Thu, 29 Jul 1999 13:32:54 PST Subject: Re: RODMAKERS digest 1410 Dave, are you sure it is black and orange, the #290 is the only one that Ihave listed as such. I have black and yellow, black and white, black andgreen and black and red. Some times the varnish makes the white look alittle bit orange.DellDell & Marie CoppockThe Flyfisher& the Quilterhttp://www.trwebsites.com/dell/e-mail dellc@nextdim.comflyfisher@nextdim.com----- Original Message ----- ;and Collecting Subject: RODMAKERS digest 1410 RODMAKERS Digest 1410 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Glue Info? 2) wasting time 3) Re: Glue Info? 4) Broken Tap - Thanks 5) Re: Finishing 6) Re: wasting time 7) Re: Broken tap @#%$^&! Help! 8) Re: Finishing> by Dennis Haftel 9) glue 10) Thanks for logan lathe info 11) Re: Finishing 12) Re: Finishing 13) HEXROD 14) orangeand black jasper 15) Re: Gunsmith 16) Trying to contact 17) Drying time before using a rod. 18) RE: Finishing 19) Re: Drying time before using a rod. 20) (no subject) from bdcreek@crosswinds.net Thu Jul 29 16:50:25 1999 (envelope- from bdcreek@crosswinds.net) Subject: Re: RODMAKERS digest 1410 I think Graham Maisey (sp??) has some black/orange Elephant silk on hisweb site. Brian from Turbotrk@aol.com Thu Jul 29 19:53:02 1999 Subject: Re: glue In a message dated 99-07-28 20:24:39 EDT, Turbotrk@aol.com writes: Ok I can answer my own question. I tried it on a butt section. I timedwhen I mixed it for further reference. It started getting really hard at 20 minutes which made straightning very hard. I picke it up at 12 hours and gave it a small flex and it delaminated on the tip. I now have a ruined butt section. Do not try this epoxy for rods. It doesn't have what it takes. stuart miller from Craig.Naldrett@ibm.net Thu Jul 29 20:29:54 1999 (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA21468; Fri, 30 Jul 1999 01:29:44 GMT Subject: Re: Glue Info? Yup, Terry's right again, found this glue at Lee Valley in can asdescribed, it is the AM18 I had the specs for.Bought it to test anyway,used it on a few splices & it did not holdworth a darn (i.e. shear) & under heat which would be used to straightenit bubbled & let go.Oh well, found a stockpile of the Resorcinol I've been using so I'm goodto go.CheersCraig from hexagon@odyssee.net Thu Jul 29 21:07:37 1999 Subject: Re: Glue Info? Craig,Resorcinol is an excellent adhesive, probably too good for what we requireunless we keep our rods submerged in water.Urac is an adhesive that is good enough and is a lot less expensive butrequires you to get a move on like resorcinol for the open time is short.There are thermosetting resins on the market that only cure with heat sothere is not the urgency but requires an oven to cure.Terry Terry's right again, found this glue at Lee Valley in can asdescribed, it is the AM18 I had the specs for.Bought it to test anyway,used it on a few splices & it did not holdworth a darn (i.e. shear) & under heat which would be used to straightenit bubbled & let go.Oh well, found a stockpile of the Resorcinol I've been using so I'm goodto go.CheersCraig from sjstill@iquest.net Thu Jul 29 21:27:28 1999 0000 (209.43.47.197) Subject: A couple of things fs Hi All, Was going thru some stuff and came upon a pack of chrome strippingguides ofvarious sizes and shapes. About 55-60 in all. Would like to sell 'em, allin one lot if possible, but might part them out in 10 packs. Also have a copy of The Fine Bamboo Fly Rod by Kirkfield. Has an archivalcover over a very good dust jacket. I'm not doing much with rods of late,so I guess I don't need this stuff any longer. Contact me at sjstill@iquest.net if interested. Steve from hexagon@odyssee.net Thu Jul 29 21:30:24 1999 Subject: Re: glue Epoxy is not an adhesive for rods or wood, it will not stand up to theseasonalvariations in moisture content unless you coat the whole rod in epoxy!whichsounds revolting.There are adhesives out there with a 50 year documented history in thelaminatingof cane rods.Why take a chance?Terry Turbotrk@aol.com wrote: In a message dated 99-07-28 20:24:39 EDT, Turbotrk@aol.com writes: the" Super Glue Epoxy Adhesive Super Strength Extra Working Time"? Itclaims a30 minute working time with a handling time of 7 hours and a cure timeof 24hours. The temperature use range is -*85 to +225. Kinda sounds andlookslike Shell Epon but not exactly. Has anyone used it? I saw it in HomeDepot and the cost was $2.25. Looked like plenty for one rod. Maybe we can make this thing one step simpler. What do ya'll think? Stuart Miller >> Ok I can answer my own question. I tried it on a butt section. I timedwhenI mixed it for further reference. It started getting really hard at 20minutes which made straightning very hard. I picke it up at 12 hoursandgave it a small flex and it delaminated on the tip. I now have a ruinedbuttsection. Do not try this epoxy for rods. It doesn't have what it takes. stuart miller from gl@msrr.dmso.mil Fri Jul 30 12:02:35 1999 triton.dmso.mil(8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA27252 for ;Fri, 30 Jul 1999 Subject: fitting ferrule to a small rod i am building a small rod, with a dimension at the ferrule (.110) which isslightly smaller than the smallest ferrule i can find (8/64). can anyoneadvise me of the best way to fit this ferrule, or of a source for a smallerferrule? tks.--------------------gary mischcdr, usn (ret.) from rawhitejr@cyberportal.net Fri Jul 30 13:12:46 1999 Subject: Re: Drying time before using a rod. "michael w. shaffer" wrote: Guys,Although I'm only at the stage of final planing my rod tip pieces (anotherdelightful activity), I was reading George Mauer's book and came upon thestatement that you need to wait 3 months before using a rod afterfinishing(rest of msg deleted) In George's book, the "3 month drying" is one of several printing errorsthat hetold me about; it should have read "3 days". George's web page is listed ontheRodmakers website; his e-mail address is DrBamboo@aol.com. from anglport@con2.com Fri Jul 30 14:32:52 1999 Subject: Bamboo info I just saw this on the Rec.woodworking news group. If any of you guys whowanted to try growing your own are interested......I have NO interest inthis, in any interpretation you care to give that phrase *G*.Art I'm forwarding this from another newsgroup in case someone here is interested. -Rick (note: area code for number is 919) Newsgroups: triangle.forsaleSubject: fs: Bamboo We are going to clear cut approximately 1/2 acre of very tall, veryhealthy bamboo. It ranges in size from 1" to 5" around and about 20 to30 feet high. Any suggestions for what to do with it? Is anyone interested in buyingit? Call us at 303-0472 or email back to aggraves@worldnet.att.net. from anglport@con2.com Fri Jul 30 14:35:03 1999 Subject: Finishing Thanks to all for the advice. I've come up with several ideas to try. Willlet all know if any single one is an absolute winner!Art from stuart.tod@virgin.net Fri Jul 30 15:47:49 1999 (InterMail v4.01.01.02 201-229-111-106) with SMTP Fri, 30 Jul 1999 21:46:51 +0100 Subject: Re: fitting ferrule to a small rod Try 'Hardy' style - glue six strips of bamboo to the flats, slightly longerthan the ferrule fit, on both sections, then turn down to size, taperingdown to the blank under the ferrule tabs. No 'power fibres' are cut on theblank - making for a stronger joint! Stuart ----- Original Message ----- Subject: fitting ferrule to a small rod i am building a small rod, with a dimension at the ferrule (.110) which isslightly smaller than the smallest ferrule i can find (8/64). can anyoneadvise me of the best way to fit this ferrule, or of a source for a smallerferrule? tks.--------------------gary mischcdr, usn (ret.) from jwilcox@netsync.net Fri Jul 30 22:29:18 1999 Subject: back from vacation boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0004_01BEDAE3.6E5BE4A0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BEDAE3.6E5BE4A0 SET RODMAKERS MAIL ACK ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BEDAE3.6E5BE4A0 ACK ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BEDAE3.6E5BE4A0-- from iank@nelson.planet.org.nz Sat Jul 31 17:28:35 1999 sage.ts.co.nz with SMTP id KAA22073 for ;Sun, 1 Aug 199910:28:39 +1200 Subject: 9' Hardy cc de france Several people asked for the measurements of the 9' Hardy .I managed tofindtime to measure the Hardy , cc de France this weekend. The rod looks tohavethe original varnish , not too heavy a coat so I guess the usual .004 - .006allowance should be made. I tried this rod out with a # 5 line which I happened to have on a reel onmy work bench and it certainly has a lovely action and cast the #5 well ,even though it is likely to be a #6 designation. I have not tried buildingrods over 8' , but think I will build one of these after trying this one . Measurements below are as measured . 1" .o88 , .087 , .0915" .103 , .103 , .10410" .128 , .126 , .12415" .154 , .152 , .15520" .169 , .166 , .16825" .182 , .181 , .17630" .191 , .192 , .18935" .202 , .201 , .19940" .216 , .217 , .21444 1/2" .220 , .224 , .22250" .232 , .238 , .23256" .248 , .251 , .24660" .260 , .258 , .26065" .270 , .272 , .27570 1/2 .284 , .282 , .28675" .297 , .298 , .29480" .309 , .306 , .30785" .312 , .313 , .31890" .327 , .323 , .331 ( measured twice to check)95" .330 , .335 , .33297 1/2 .333 , .338 , .33598 - 108 handle. Guides. 5", 10 3/4 , 16" , 23 3/4 , 32 3/4 , 45 1/2 , 58 1/2,70" , stripper at 84 1/2 " slim cork handle with sliding band , Hardy " universal reel holder" 1 1/4inches from the bottom and a 3/4 inch butt cap. regards Ian Kearney from ralph.shuey@redstone.army.mil Sat Jul 31 20:51:12 1999 1.redstone.army.mil RODMAKERS@wugate.wustl.eduSubject: RE: 9' Hardy cc de france I'd like to tag along on this message as I have a Hardy rod from 1964 (theonly help I got from Hardy) that is an 8'6" 5/6wt 3/2 that has all themarkings removed because of an early refinish. My rod builder faithfullyresurrected the rod relative to wraps/guides/intermediates etc from the"ghosts" but no luck with the "name" of the rod other than Palakona. Thething that is unusual about the rod is that it has 12 (yes, tweleve) guidesplus the stripper and tip top. My builder assures me that the guides arecorrect, but it did cause him to scratch his head also. Does anybody outthere have a clue as to what Hardy rod this is, it casts like a dream,handles just like my Granger 8'6" 4wt. Thanks, Ralph Shuey -----Original Message----- Subject: 9' Hardy cc de france Several people asked for the measurements of the 9' Hardy .I managed tofindtime to measure the Hardy , cc de France this weekend. The rod looks tohavethe original varnish , not too heavy a coat so I guess the usual .004 - .006allowance should be made. I tried this rod out with a # 5 line which I happened to have on a reel onmy work bench and it certainly has a lovely action and cast the #5 well ,even though it is likely to be a #6 designation. I have not tried buildingrods over 8' , but think I will build one of these after trying this one . Measurements below are as measured . 1" .o88 , .087 , .0915" .103 , .103 , .10410" .128 , .126 , .12415" .154 , .152 , .15520" .169 , .166 , .16825" .182 , .181 , .17630" .191 , .192 , .18935" .202 , .201 , .19940" .216 , .217 , .21444 1/2" .220 , .224 , .22250" .232 , .238 , .23256" .248 , .251 , .24660" .260 , .258 , .26065" .270 , .272 , .27570 1/2 .284 , .282 , .28675" .297 , .298 , .29480" .309 , .306 , .30785" .312 , .313 , .31890" .327 , .323 , .331 ( measured twice to check)95" .330 , .335 , .33297 1/2 .333 , .338 , .33598 - 108 handle. Guides. 5", 10 3/4 , 16" , 23 3/4 , 32 3/4 , 45 1/2 , 58 1/2,70" , stripper at 84 1/2 " slim cork handle with sliding band , Hardy " universal reel holder" 1 1/4inches from the bottom and a 3/4 inch butt cap. regards Ian Kearney